The Cacti Are Sorted

Wed, May 20, 2026 Year 3, Autumn 20

Al and Codey talk about The Farmer Was Replaced.

Timings

00:00:00: Theme Tune
00:00:30: Intro
00:02:20: What Have We Been Up To
00:06:37: Game News
00:38:38: The Farmer Was Replaced
01:43:56: Outro

Contact

Al on Mastodon: https://mastodon.scot/@TheScotBot
Email Us: https://harvestseason.club/contact/

Transcript

Theme Tune

(29s) Al:

Hello, farmers, and welcome to another episode of the harvest season.

Intro

(32s) Al:

My name is Al.

(35s) Codey:

My name is Cody.

(37s) Al:

And we’re here today to talk about cottage card games.

(40s) Codey:

Oh, woo.

(41s)

I don’t know if you heard the dogs barking.

(43s) Al:

I did not.

(43s) Codey:

Okay.

(44s) Al:

I did not.

(45s)

Do you know, I was, it’s funny, Cody.

(48s)

So, um, this episode we’re talking about the farmer was replaced, which is about automating a farm and uh, we were talking about AI before the episode recording.

(52s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(52s)

Mm-hmm.

(57s)

We sure were.

(57s) Al:

It’s just a funny, that was not where my brain was.

(1m 2s)

My brain wasn’t AI because of this.

(1m 4s)

It was just an interesting interest.

(1m 6s) Codey:

Right.

(1m 6s)

My brain, I forgot we were recording today.

(1m 9s)

I thought we were recording.

(1m 10s)

Actually, I don’t even know what I thought we were.

(1m 12s)

I think I knew that we were recording today.

(1m 14s)

My brain, it just, that information had not entered my brain.

(1m 18s)

Um, but until I…

(1m 19s) Al:

So when you got my message, you were like, ah, recording today.

(1m 22s) Codey:

Well, no, so I had I had gotten like a notification before that that was like, hey, you’re going to be recording in an hour and I was like, oh.

(1m 26s) Al:

Ah.

(1m 29s) Codey:

Oh.

(1m 31s)

Um, and then.

(1m 33s) Al:

Is the problem?

(1m 34s)

Is the problem that we’ve gone quite a few weeks without it and then we’re doing 2 weeks in a row?

(1m 38s)

So you were thinking about next…

(1m 39s) Codey:

Well, so I think it was just that I for, because yeah, I’ve been out of it for a bit.

(1m 44s)

Like I’ve been focussed on other things.

(1m 45s)

My best friend just visited, blah, blah, blah.

(1m 47s)

Um, and I’m kind of just now joining, rejoining the world of day-to-day, like, things happen and are scheduled.

(1m 55s)

Um, but also I thought we were doing a different game today.

(1m 59s)

So I forgot that we even played this game.

(2m 1s) Al:

You did play it though.

(2m 2s) Codey:

I did.

(2m 3s) Al:

Good.

(2m 3s) Codey:

Um, so yeah, that’s fine.

(2m 5s) Al:

Oopsie.

(2m 6s) Codey:

That’s fine.

(2m 6s) Al:

We’re doing the other game next week.

(2m 7s) Codey:

Yeah.

(2m 8s)

Correct.

(2m 10s)

Um, I do.

(2m 10s) Al:

All right.

(2m 11s)

Woo.

(2m 12s) Codey:

yeah.

(2m 13s)

So we’re talking about the farmer’s replace today.

(2m 14s)

Very excited about that.

(2m 15s) Al:

Uh, great.

(2m 17s)

We’re gonna, yeah, we’re gonna talk about that.

(2m 19s)

We got a bunch of game news before that, Cody.

What Have We Been Up To

(2m 21s) Al:

What have you been up to?

(2m 23s) Codey:

I have been, uh, chilling.

(2m 26s)

My, like I just mentioned, my best friend was visiting, so that was really nice.

(2m 30s)

She my best friend from Oregon.

(2m 32s)

We’ve been friends for like over a decade now.

(2m 34s)

It’s nuts.

(2m 34s)

Um, and she flew into my area and we just like went on a bunch of adventures.

(2m 39s)

And she and I bond a lot over books.

(2m 44s)

So we went to a lot of bookstores and I now have a lot of books.

(2m 48s)

I mean, I always have a lot of books.

(2m 48s) Al:

Hmm.

(2m 50s) Codey:

My tubi red pile is like huge, but um, I now have like more that I want to read.

(2m 56s)

So I’ve been reading more, which is lovely.

(2m 59s)

Um, I’ve been trying to scroll less on my phone, uh, finding myself in the doom cycle.

(3m 6s)

I was just listening to a podcast today and someone just referred to uh, doing phone.

(3m 6s) Al:

Hmm.

(3m 11s) Codey:

Like, because sometimes you’ll just pick up your phone and do phone for like half hour and then you’re like, what was I just doing?

(3m 12s) Al:

Hmm.

(3m 19s) Codey:

Like where did that half hour go?

(3m 20s)

So I’m trying to do that less, which is nice.

(3m 22s)

Um, and that has included reading, but also uh, some games.

(3m 26s)

So I’m still playing House Slipper 2 with my best friend Devin.

(3m 29s)

Um, Slay the Spire 2, uh, with my roommate and my husband.

(3m 34s)

And then, uh, I’ve been, I picked up Outbound, which came out this week, which is the Van Life game.

(3m 39s)

And I am enjoying it.

(3m 41s)

That is what I will say.

(3m 42s)

Um, yeah.

(3m 43s) Al:

Nice.

(3m 45s) Codey:

So that’s kind of what I’ve been up to.

(3m 47s)

What about you, Al?

(3m 48s) Al:

Well, I’ve also been playing outbound, picked up.

(3m 52s)

Coincidence or not, maybe you’ll find out next week.

(3m 55s)

Obviously, I’ve also been playing the farmer was replaced, and we’ll have a lot to talk about that later on, and I have finished Little Rocket Lab.

(4m 6s)

So that was good.

(4m 7s) Codey:

How how was that?

(4m 8s) Al:

Did you listen to last week’s episode?

(4m 10s) Codey:

I did not, but I saw something on the Slack, and I didn’t know if you were going to mention that you really liked it, and might have been emotional.

(4m 15s) Al:

Is good.

(4m 16s)

Yeah, it’s good.

(4m 19s)

Yeah, yeah.

(4m 19s)

Well, so I think I did, I did, I don’t know whether I explicitly said it or not, but I did certainly imply that there were some emotions through the game and yeah, the, the, there was another point when I was playing through that, that, that got me and made me feel some some emotions uh as I was playing that game.

(4m 31s) Codey:

Yeah.

(4m 43s) Al:

It’s really good.

(4m 44s) Codey:

Where do…

(4m 45s)

Where do you put those emotions on a spirit fairer scale?

(4m 49s) Al:

Uh, it’s not as, it’s, it’s not as rip your heart out as the Spirit Fader, but, like, it’s still related to death in a way, but not the same sort of thing, right?

(4m 53s) Codey:

Okay.

(4m 58s)

Okay.

(5m) Al:

Like, um, there’s, I, I, I don’t know if anything will get as close as, as, as, uh, I don’t know if anything will ever hit the peak of like taking your dementia riddled friend to the death gate and seeing her reawaken just as she goes through.

(5m 18s) Codey:

Yeah.

(5m 20s)

Yep.

(5m 21s) Al:

I don’t think anything will ever get quite as emotional as that.

(5m 21s) Codey:

Yeah.

(5m 22s)

Yeah.

(5m 24s) Al:

Uh, But, um, It was certainly, it was, it was pretty high.

(5m 27s) Codey:

That, yeah.

(5m 31s) Al:

I, I, I, I, it stuck the landing.

(5m 32s) Codey:

Okay.

(5m 35s) Al:

I’ll put it that way.

(5m 36s) Codey:

Okay.

(5m 37s)

That’s good.

(5m 37s) Al:

It was really good.

(5m 38s)

It was done really well.

(5m 40s)

The story is really nicely spread throughout the game.

(5m 45s)

And I thought it was really well done.

(5m 45s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(5m 49s) Al:

The gameplay kind of just continues to be the same and enjoyable.

(5m 54s)

And by the time it was finished, I was like, yeah, okay, cool.

(5m 56s)

I’m content

(5m 57s)

I’m good to finish this and let it go.

(5m 57s) Codey:

Nice, that’s good.

(6m) Al:

There wasn’t really any post game.

(6m 1s)

mainly because I’d done all of the things as I was going on, so there wasn’t really anything to do, but I’m okay with that because I got my, what, 15 hours out of it and it was an enjoyable experience and I’m done now.

(6m 5s) Codey:

Mm.

(6m 14s) Al:

I could see how some people would just like put so much time into trying to make the most efficient system making all of the items all at the same time or something.

(6m 15s) Codey:

Yay, that’s good.

(6m 24s)

Yeah.

(6m 26s) Al:

Not me.

(6m 26s)

I have other games to play because we’re talking about the farmer was replaced this week and another game next week.

(6m 27s) Codey:

Yeah, no.

(6m 32s)

Mm-hmm.

(6m 32s)

Mm-hmm, Mm-hmm.

(6m 32s) Al:

So can’t be doing all the same things.

(6m 35s) Codey:

Yeah.

(6m 35s) Al:

Uh, yeah, okay, cool.

Game News

(6m 38s) Al:

Should we talk about some news?

(6m 39s)

First up, you can tell that Kudi has not really been aware of the show notes until I know where to go because there’s no comments here.

(6m 40s) Codey:

Yep.

(6m 49s)

They’re not riddled with purple texted comments.

(6m 52s) Al:

Yeah.

(6m 53s) Codey:

No, I will, uh, I did look through them, but I will, uh, in real time respond.

(7m) Al:

That’s kind of how a podcast works.

(7m 4s) Codey:

No, I normally, I like to prepare.

(7m 6s)

It’s the autistic part of me that doesn’t want an un, like rehearsed social situation.

(7m 15s)

Um, but no, I’m feeling, I’m just feeling more like relaxed these days, so it’s fine because defence and having that like off of my back.

(7m 25s)

So.

(7m 27s)

Oh.

Bitter Harvest

(7m 28s) Al:

Bitter Harvest releases on the 22nd of May.

(7m 32s)

That is on Friday.

(7m 33s)

So this is the like there’s a murderer, I think.

(7m 38s)

Oh no, this is not, it’s not, there’s not the murderer.

(7m 38s) Codey:

What?

(7m 40s)

No, it’s not.

(7m 40s) Al:

This is the one where you’re… Shut up.

(7m 43s)

Like, it’s called Bitter Harvest.

(7m 46s)

does sound like that one.

(7m 47s)

There’s a few of them that have been like that.

(7m 49s)

No, this is the, uh, the one the one with moral conundrums and you can…

(7m 50s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(7m 58s)

Mm-hmm.

(7m 58s)

Yeah, that basically, uh, uh, farming life’s him about ambition, reinvention, and quiet revenge, and that you basically,

(8m 6s) Al:

Oh yes, that’s what it was.

(8m 7s)

The revenge.

(8m 8s) Codey:

You basically come up to your place.

(8m 10s)

There was like a farm that you were promised and you get there and someone else is working the farm.

(8m 15s)

And the, I love the picture of it because it shows someone farming and then there’s a character in the foreground that’s holding garbage bags in like fists and they’re just like clearly grumpy. Um, because it says that the 1st thing that you, uh, the 1st job that you take up is the town’s garbage collector.

(8m 34s)

Um, piecing together a new life from what others throw away.

(8m 38s)

Um, I, so a word from the, I’m just going to read this because I love this word from the developer.

(8m 44s)

Bitter Harvest started his game about starting over from nothing, but it quickly became about power, resentment, and what people are willing to justify when they feel wronged.

(8m 50s)

I wanted the game to feel calm on the surface, but slowly revealing the consequences of the players’ choices as they climb higher.

(8m 56s)

Uh, I’m in.

(8m 57s)

I love games like this that like make you feel a thing.

(9m 1s)

Um, I’m trying to figure out, is it only?

(9m 6s) Al:

I think so.

(9m 7s) Codey:

Ugh, okay.

(9m 9s)

Um, yeah, it’s coming out on steam on the 22nd.

(9m 13s)

Um, and it’s, uh, so Jeff got one and I could probably use his and play it.

(9m 14s) Al:

Don’t you ever seen daycare?

(9m 20s)

Um, yeah, sounds like you have a steam deck then.

(9m 23s) Codey:

Yeah, it’s fine.

(9m 25s)

I’ll probably make him make him get it for me.

(9m 28s)

Um, and then he’ll have to share his steam deck with me and he can cry me a river.

(9m 35s)

Married life.

(9m 37s)

Yeah, I’m really excited about that.

(9m 40s)

Um, choose whether to rise honestly, manipulate others or something in between.

(9m 45s)

How do you feel about this game?

(9m 48s)

Because I feel like you’ve been wanting to break people up in games for a really, really long time.

(9m 52s) Al:

Yeah, I think it depends on where it goes, how far it goes.

(9m 57s)

Um, uh, I mean, I’m certainly intrigued because it takes the like standard background to a farming game and goes, oh, wait, no.

(9m 57s) Codey:

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

(10m 1s)

Mm-hmm.

(10m 7s) Al:

And that in and of itself is an interesting thing because that’s such a rare thing in farming games where it’s not just like, oh, here’s a farm.

(10m 12s) Codey:

Yeah.

(10m 16s) Al:

So, um, I am very interested.

(10m 19s)

I don’t know.

(10m 21s)

I haven’t planned out the next few weeks in terms of my gaming time because I’m coming into a complicated time.

(10m 23s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(10m 27s)

Mm-hmm.

(10m 27s) Al:

Um, uh, so I don’t know when I’ll be able to play it, but I think I would like to play it.

(10m 32s)

So I guess we’ll see.

(10m 34s)

We’ll see how me and…

(10m 38s) Codey:

I don’t like that.

OddFauna

(10m 39s) Al:

Odd fauna, secret of the terror beast, have announced that their early access comes out on the 2nd of June.

(10m 48s)

They’ve said they’ve shifted their launch date to the 2nd of June.

(10m 51s)

I don’t remember them announcing a previous release date.

(10m 55s)

Which would require me going back in their news.

(10m 56s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(10m 56s)

Yeah, I don’t.

(10m 59s) Al:

Oh, here we go.

(10m 59s)

The 13th of May was apparently when it was meant to come out.

(11m 2s)

So they’ve pushed it back.

(11m 5s) Codey:

That’s fine.

(11m 6s)

Um, I really like how this game looks and I love the angry snail.

(11m 9s) Al:

Hmm.

(11m 12s)

Yes, I agree.

(11m 14s) Codey:

Um, he’s just so grumpy.

(11m 18s)

And I love it.

(11m 19s)

Um, yeah, it’s a cute, cute game.

(11m 22s)

Very interesting, very unique art style for sure.

(11m 26s)

it’s giving where the wild things are.

(11m 28s) Al:

Yeah, kind of fabricy.

(11m 31s) Codey:

Yes.

(11m 32s)

Oh, you’re on the back of something.

(11m 33s)

Your world is on the back of something.

(11m 35s) Al:

Yeah, the terror beast.

(11m 36s) Codey:

You’re so right.

(11m 37s)

That’s what it’s called.

(11m 39s)

You’re right, you’re right.

(11m 39s) Al:

Come on, Cody, lock in.

(11m 42s) Codey:

You’re right.

(11m 43s)

Um, yeah, early access.

(11m 46s)

I’m this is something we could maybe talk about at another time, but I’m getting really bitter about early accents.

(11m 51s) Al:

I feel like it’s something we talked about many a time.

(11m 54s) Codey:

I think I’ve, I think I’ve finally hit a point because like I think I’ve talked to y’all about how you guys feel about early access, but I’m hitting a point where I myself am also like, this is stupid.

(12m) Al:

Yeah.

(12m 5s) Codey:

So.

(12m 6s) Al:

Yeah, I, I, I, yeah.

(12m 10s)

It’s difficult because it’s not like, I understand the positives of it, but it also, as with everything just ends up the scale, just can always end up in a ridiculous degree, right?

(12m 22s)

That’s always the problem.

(12m 23s) Codey:

Yeah.

(12m 23s)

Yeah.

(12m 25s)

But uh, looking forward to hearing more about this game.

(12m 29s) Al:

Yeah.

(12m 29s) Codey:

Woo.

Snacktorio

(12m 32s) Al:

Next up, Snack Torio.

(12m 35s)

So this is the Factorio-esque game from Elle, the developer of Ethico.

(12m 42s) Codey:

And my, And mud, and mud born.

(12m 43s) Al:

I was like B game.

(12m 45s)

And Mudborn, yeah.

(12m 47s) Codey:

Um.

(12m 47s) Al:

Um, which maybe someone we’ll talk about in the podcast sometime.

(12m 51s) Codey:

Yeah, that’d be cool.

(12m 52s)

Um.

(12m 54s)

I, so I haven’t really like looked at this in a while.

(12m 58s)

Uh, but I love how this looks.

(13m)

And then the trail, the official release date trailer that Elle put together is hilarious.

(13m 6s) Al:

Yeah, I didn’t actually say the news, did I?

(13m 6s) Codey:

Um…

(13m 8s) Al:

I just said Snack Torio, which is the game.

(13m 9s)

Yeah, it comes on the 4th of June.

(13m 10s)

There you go.

(13m 11s)

the news.

(13m 12s)

Continue.

(13m 13s) Codey:

Yeah, uh, it’s also available on Apple, which I’m super excited about.

(13m 18s)

Um, because I will get it.

(13m 19s)

But in the trailer, it’s basically like showing the game, it’s, so it’s got like terraria style, like world exploration, like it’s a side scrolling like thing, like terraria instead of being like a top down.

(13m 29s) Al:

Yes.

(13m 35s) Codey:

It’s like a side side side.

(13m 36s)

Um, but… side side, but it’s… It’s not top down.

(13m 39s) Al:

I know I know what you mean.

(13m 40s)

I know what you mean.

(13m 42s) Codey:

It’s side side.

(13m 43s) Al:

Ladies, 8080.

(13m 45s) Codey:

It’s crab, crab game.

(13m 48s)

Um, crab style.

(13m 49s)

And, uh, but it’s like shows, everything’s just, everything gets comebacks to crumbs.

(13m 51s) Al:

Everything’s crabs.

(13m 53s)

Even games, apparently.

(13m 56s) Codey:

Um, you basically, like, our building, uh, like you grow food, and then you cook the food, and it’s just like all quiet and quaint, and then it just says feed, and it, like, gets really like ominous.

(14m 9s)

And then it’s just like, grow.

(14m 12s) Al:

Hmm.

(14m 12s) Codey:

Or I guess it says build, build, cook, feed.

(14m 16s)

It’s basically all about like having to feed these beasts that, honestly, some of them kind of look like elder horrors.

(14m 24s)

I don’t know exactly or if we’ll get more detail about them, but very cute.

(14m 29s)

Um, I will get more when I play the game.

(14m 29s) Al:

I mean, you might get more if you play the…

(14m 34s) Codey:

Not might and if, like, will and and when.

(14m 38s)

Um, yeah, super excited about that.

(14m 40s)

Uh, looks cute.

(14m 42s)

Highly recommend checking out the trailer, the trailer and the updated demo.

(14m 47s) Al:

All right.

(14m 47s)

All right.

(14m 49s)

Harvest Moon, Echos of Tradia.

Harvest Moon: Echoes Of Teradea

(14m 54s) Al:

Have announced that they’re releasing on the 24th of September.

(14m 57s)

And the full list of platforms we now have.

(15m 4s)

Switch one and 2 PS5 and Xbox series X and S.

(15m 9s)

The Switch Physical Switch cartridge is one of the Switch 2 editions, which comes with the Switch one version and the upgrade.

(15m 19s)

So you can buy the same game and

(15m 19s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(15m 25s)

Mm-hmm.

(15m 26s)

I’m glad, so when I looked at the article because it’s all all about Nintendo and how it’s coming to Switch 2.

(15m 31s)

Um, and how it’s going to be the 1st Harvestman game on the Switch 2, that’s like for the Switch 2,

(15m 36s) Al:

Yeah.

(15m 37s) Codey:

I didn’t realise it’s also on Xbox.

(15m 39s)

So I’m kind of excited now because this game looks, it looks interesting.

(15m 43s)

Uh, it’s giving, like, because it’s open world exploration.

(15m 48s)

It kind of looks like this is something I might want to play.

(15m 51s)

Is that a clouded leopard?

(15m 53s)

Wait a minute.

(15m 53s)

That is a leopard.

(15m 55s)

Okay.

(15m 55s)

Um, in this game.

(15m 57s)

I need more answers.

(15m 59s)

But I…

(16m) Al:

Yeah, so my, my, I, I worry that this is more like Winds of Anthos, which is the game I wasn’t a huge fan of rather than…

(16m 9s) Codey:

Yeah.

(16m 12s) Al:

But, I mean, obviously, I’m gonna, I’m gonna…

(16m 19s) Codey:

Yeah.

(16m 20s)

Uh, depending on if it’s on Game Pass.

(16m 22s)

I might play it as well.

(16m 24s)

The September is kind of far out there.

(16m 24s) Al:

Hmm.

(16m 27s) Codey:

I don’t know what I’m going to be doing in September, so.

(16m 31s)

I don’t even know what I’ll be doing next month.

(16m 33s)

So we shall see.

(16m 35s) Al:

I haven’t seen anything about it.

(16m 39s) Codey:

Yeah.

(16m 40s)

I mean, I am also in a better financial situation now so I could just buy it if I wanted, but I don’t know.

(16m 46s)

We will find out to be determined.

(16m 49s) Al:

It looks like none of the Harvest Moon games are on Game Pass, so I’m guessing probably.

(16m 53s) Codey:

Mm.

(16m 54s)

Okay, good to know.

(16m 56s)

good to know.

(16m 57s) Al:

Next up, Cosmic Coop have released their museum update.

Cosmic Coop

(17m 3s) Al:

Can you guess what’s in this update?

(17m 5s) Codey:

I think it is a, uh, chicken factory that turns chicken.

(17m 9s) Al:

Correct, a museum.

(17m 10s)

You can now donate, visit to the museum.

(17m 14s)

You can now visit the museum and start filling it with collectables that are currently 73 collectables to donate and complete.

(17m 21s)

There you go.

(17m 22s) Codey:

I would love to know.

(17m 24s)

Oh, he also, the developer also asks, would you like me to add an achievement for donating the collectables to the museum?

(17m 30s)

That is a silly question.

(17m 31s)

The answer is yes.

(17m 32s)

Um, and I would like to see what kind of stuff, like an example of what could go into this.

(17m 39s) Al:

Well, I see a dinosaur skull, so I’m guessing there’s fossils and I see more fossils.

(17m 43s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(17m 47s) Al:

I don’t know.

(17m 47s)

It does look like it’s mostly kind of like fossils from what I see on the front of it.

(17m 52s)

Like I’m not seeing.

(17m 53s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(17m 54s) Al:

I’m not seeing any live animals, which is different from many, but an interesting a good.

(18m) Codey:

Yeah.

(18m)

Well, I guess museums, now that I’m thinking about it, museums don’t usually have an aquarium and an insectarium attach them.

(18m 6s) Al:

Yeah.

(18m 8s) Codey:

It’s like got to be, it’s going to be like specimens, but…

(18m 10s) Al:

Well.

(18m 11s)

Well, so here’s an interesting thing.

(18m 13s)

I found out recently that the National Museum of Scotland used to have massive fish tanks in its entrance area.

(18m 21s)

It does not anymore, but in the 90s it had these massive fish tanks with…

(18m 22s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(18m 28s)

That would be cool.

(18m 29s)

I recently went to the Carnegie Museum of Natural History in Pittsburgh, and one of my friends works there, uh, in the invertebrate zoology division, and I got to go back, and then I found out not only does she work there, she curates it.

(18m 40s)

I was like, oh, I didn’t realise.

(18m 43s)

And she gave us like a tour of the back and it was really cool.

(18m 46s)

We got to see the 1st succession log and the 1st thing that was ever donated there in like the late 1700s or whatever, were 2 Egyptian mummies by Andrew Carnegie himself.

(18m 55s)

And then like 3 or 4 lines later.

(18m 58s)

It was like, Miss Estelle from Williamsport, Pennsylvania, donated a salamander, and it was really cute to like just see, like, I don’t know, because I’ve never really thought of like individuals, like, like a normal citizen, like donating to the museum.

(19m 5s) Al:

Hmm.

(19m 14s) Codey:

Like, would you donate something to your local museum?

(19m 18s) Al:

Don’t think I would have anything of interest.

(19m 20s) Codey:

But like, how do you know it’s it’s not of interest?

(19m 22s) Al:

That’s a good question.

(19m 23s) Codey:

Like, what if you were, so like, what if you were to find a really cool, like, rock or bug or something?

(19m 28s)

And if you don’t know, I don’t, so that’s the thing.

(19m 30s)

I think a lot of people are really detached from these things and you can just be like, this is neat.

(19m 32s) Al:

Yeah.

(19m 36s) Codey:

Do you do we have one of these?

(19m 38s) Al:

I guess the problem is, right?

(19m 40s)

Like we have, we are now living in a time where people have been finding and putting things in museums for 100s of years now.

(19m 46s)

And I feel like there was a time where it was like, if you found something, it was probably new, right?

(19m 53s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(19m 53s) Al:

Because people weren’t really looking for things at that point.

(19m 55s)

And then so people started looking for things and we’re like, hey, this seems cool.

(20m)

People were like, yeah, that’s cool.

(20m 2s)

But like if I go outside and I find a rock.

(20m 4s)

It’s probably a rock people already know about.

(20m 4s) Codey:

Yeah.

(20m 5s)

I will tell you uh, not always the case with bugs.

(20m 9s)

So, I feel like there’s this sense of wonder that people had about like discovery and how you could just pick something up in your backyard and it could be something that has not been recorded before.

(20m 19s)

That is likely true for insects or for insect interactions.

(20m 20s) Al:

Yeah.

(20m 24s) Codey:

So if you go outside and see like a leaf mine or a gall or something, that might be something that is novel to science.

(20m 29s)

So recapture that wonder, you guys.

(20m 32s)

Um, anyway, all of this to say, uh, cosmic coupe should have more than just fossils because, uh, history and and interesting things exist in the real, not just in the past.

Hello Kitty Island Adventure

(20m 46s) Al:

Hello, Katie Island Adventure.

(20m 47s)

I have announced their under the sea celebration is now live.

(20m 52s) Codey:

Yep, you go under the water

(20m 53s) Al:

As you do, which you could already do, but I guess now you’re fishing for treasures.

(20m 55s) Codey:

Oh.

(20m 56s)

Could you be a mermaid?

(20m 58s) Al:

I don’t know that.

(20m 59s)

I never finished the game.

(21m 1s)

But I knew I did get to the point where you could dive underwater.

(21m 4s)

But I don’t know if you could actively…

(21m 8s) Codey:

Because I’m seeing Hello Kitty has a mermaid tale here.

(21m 11s) Al:

It does say new mermaid outfits, which inspiration for new mermaid outfits, which implies there were…

(21m 18s) Codey:

But were they functional?

(21m 19s)

I don’t know.

(21m 21s)

Uh.

(21m 21s) Al:

What is he, functional, mermaid?

(21m 23s) Codey:

Well, so like, is it just like a fun mermaid tale like fabric thing or is it actually like something that you could use that could function as a mermaid’s tale?

(21m 33s)

Like, have you seen those people that pretend to be mermaids that like, uh,

(21m 37s) Al:

You mean does it change how you navigate underwater?

(21m 40s) Codey:

Well, no, because some of them are just like, if it’s just like cotton.

(21m 44s)

But like if you knit one, it would look cute.

(21m 48s)

Like you would look like a mermaid, but you would not be able to do mermaid things, right?

(21m 52s)

Like it’s just fabric that’s going to weigh you down and probably kill you.

(21m 56s)

But some people have made these like tails that are actually functional that you can actually like use your legs and it propels you.

(22m 3s)

Um,

(22m 4s) Al:

Yeah, so that, yes, that’s what I mean.

(22m 5s)

So like if, are you asking, does the memory tale change how you swim?

(22m 10s) Codey:

In the game, yes.

(22m 10s) Al:

Yeah, I don’t.

(22m 11s) Codey:

Sorry.

(22m 11s)

Yes.

(22m 12s)

Okay.

(22m 13s)

Let us know, listeners.

(22m 16s) Al:

I can’t even remember.

(22m 17s)

It’s possible that you can only dive with a mermaid tail.

(22m 21s)

I can’t remember.

(22m 22s)

I don’t think that was the case, but it’s been several years since I played it.

(22m 27s)

So I cannot remember.

(22m 28s)

It’s like how, you know, in Animal Crossing, you had to put on.

(22m 33s) Codey:

Yeah.

(22m 34s) Al:

as possible.

(22m 36s) Codey:

Which I thought was silly, but then after having been in the ocean multiple times, uh, wetsuit preferred you guys, that.

(22m 43s) Al:

I think it depends probably on where you are in the world.

(22m 46s) Codey:

Well, but like it’s also just like this, the, the, the salt water feels weird.

(22m 52s)

It makes it feel weird, you know?

(22m 54s) Al:

That’s the autism.

(22m 54s) Codey:

Yeah.

(22m 56s)

I saw barracuda, though.

(22m 57s)

That was cool.

(22m 57s)

When I went, uh, whatever, that snorkelling in Florida.

(22m 58s) Al:

Ooh, scary.

(23m 2s)

They’re they’re scary.

(23m 3s) Codey:

They, I mean, it’s pretty tiny.

(23m 5s)

They’re a lot smaller than you’d think, or at least the ones that I saw.

(23m 8s)

We’re smaller than, like they wouldn’t come after us.

(23m 10s)

They would just be coming after like fish.

(23m 13s) Al:

I thought pirates.

(23m 13s) Codey:

But, I mean, if you’re a fish, yes.

(23m 16s) Al:

I’ve never seen one.

(23m 17s) Codey:

Um, it probably wasn’t was only like, I’m trying to convert to metric in my mind, like half a metre.

(23m 25s)

No, less than that, like a 3rd of a metre.

(23m 28s) Al:

Oh, goodness, I was, ooh, okay.

(23m 31s) Codey:

And it wasn’t that thick.

(23m 33s)

Big in many teeth, many sharp teeth, but again, not gonna attack us.

(23m 33s) Al:

Big teeth.

(23m 39s) Codey:

No point.

(23m 41s) Al:

Fair enough.

(23m 41s)

I had just heard stuff about Barker just being scary.

(23m 45s)

That was all.

(23m 45s)

If that is…

(23m 46s) Codey:

They are definitely scary.

(23m 47s)

They are some of the best, they’re very effective as hunters, but um, I guess it’s just like being, well, no.

(23m 54s)

I was going to say it’s like, it’s like snorkelling and having a shark near you.

(23m 57s)

Like, you’re not really that scared of it.

(23m 58s) Al:

Yeah, that’s, no, where?

(23m 58s) Codey:

But I think people are genuinely scared.

(24m) Al:

Yeah, I think I think that’s a bad example.

(24m 8s) Codey:

Because I was just like, oh, that’s cool.

(24m 9s)

Look at the barracuda and I was trying to get like Jeff to come look at it, but what if it was something?

(24m 13s) Al:

It’s like walking through the forest and seeing someone with a knife, you know, you’re not going to be scared there because they’re not going to kill you probably.

(24m 19s) Codey:

No, they’re just trying to cut a rope off of a tree or something.

(24m 24s)

They’re just trying to live.

(24m 25s) Al:

still going to be scared.

(24m 26s)

I’m still going to be scared.

(24m 27s)

I’m scared walking through the forest wind.

(24m 29s)

No one there in the dark.

(24m 30s) Codey:

No, I love walking through the forest when there’s no one there.

(24m 33s) Al:

Not in the dark, in the light, yeah.

(24m 33s) Codey:

It’s great

(24m 35s)

I’ve done it in the dark before.

(24m 36s)

It’s fine.

(24m 37s) Al:

I mean, I’ve done it in the dark as well and I’ve not died yet, but that doesn’t mean it’s not scary.

(24m 41s) Codey:

Do you guys have like anything that could hurt you on your island?

(24m 45s)

Okay.

(24m 45s) Al:

So I believe there is one poisonous snake.

(24m 51s)

Venomous snake, sorry.

(24m 52s) Codey:

Then, thank you.

(24m 53s) Al:

I got there before you corrected me.

(24m 53s) Codey:

Venimus.

(24m 55s)

Yeah, you did.

(24m 56s)

You did.

(24m 57s)

Props to you.

(24m 58s)

But like how venomous?

(25m)

Like is it?

(25m 1s) Al:

Not very.

(25m 2s)

It’s a viper.

(25m 2s) Codey:

Uh, vipers can be some more, some pretty venom, much venom.

(25m 6s) Al:

It’s not the sort of it’s not bad enough that like I have ever heard of anybody ever anything.

(25m 12s)

Like even it’s like I have seen one in real life slithering very, very fast through the grass.

(25m 13s) Codey:

Okay.

(25m 16s)

Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

(25m 20s) Al:

But like I have never heard of anybody even like, you know, not even being close to being bitten by one.

(25m 21s) Codey:

They would do that, yeah.

(25m 28s) Al:

Like, they seem to be get far away from humans as quickly as possible.

(25m 29s) Codey:

I mean, that’s…

(25m 32s)

That’s true of most snakes.

(25m 32s) Al:

Right.

(25m 33s) Codey:

Like, I think when I’m hiking and there’s like rattlesnakes and people are really scared, I’m like, they don’t care about you, dude.

(25m 39s)

Like, just keep going.

(25m 40s)

They rattle to let you know they’re there so you can be like, oh, I’m sorry, ma’am.

(25m 44s) Al:

Yeah.

(25m 44s) Codey:

Like, go on with your day.

(25m 45s) Al:

Yeah, honestly, if every dangerous animal made a noise to tell you they’re there, I’d be okay with that.

(25m 50s)

Like, yes, please.

(25m 51s) Codey:

Yeah.

(25m 52s)

I think one exception is the fertilance.

(25m 55s)

When I was in Costa Rica.

(25m 56s)

They are known to, like, chase people.

(25m 58s)

Um, but the one that I almost stepped on was just napping.

(26m 2s)

She was a good girl.

(26m 3s) Al:

Oh.

(26m 4s)

Okay.

(26m 6s) Codey:

If you want photos here, I’ll post photos of the fertile answer.

(26m 6s) Al:

Uh, so yeah, I think I.

(26m 9s) Codey:

I almost stepped on. and that’s what you should look at, look for in the, in the slack this week, you guys.

(26m 15s) Al:

So I think I think probably the Viper is the most the wildlife in Scotland that would is the only one that would be of any chance of hurting you realistically.

(26m 25s) Codey:

Okay.

(26m 25s)

You’ll be.

(26m 26s) Al:

I mean, you’ve got like wildcats and stuff like that, but they’re, they’re not big.

(26m 29s) Codey:

Yeah.

(26m 31s) Al:

I could punch one.

(26m 32s) Codey:

Okay.

(26m 32s)

Cool, yeah.

(26m 33s) Al:

Although we’re, you know, there’s there’s discussion about reintroducing wolves.

(26m 39s)

So there’s that as well.

(26m 41s) Codey:

Hmm, I have thoughts about that.

(26m 41s) Al:

That’s a whole other discussion.

(26m 43s) Codey:

Yeah, I don’t know.

(26m 45s)

I don’t know how much we want to go deep in these weeds.

(26m 48s)

We didn’t we haven’t talked about critter crops yet.

Critter Crops

(26m 50s) Al:

Gritter crops have announced that they’re rewriting the whole game.

(26m 50s) Codey:

Don’t skip.

(26m 55s)

Yep.

(26m 55s) Al:

I mean, that’s basically it.

(26m 57s)

It’s a very long post about how disappointed they are in the version they released and blah, blah, blah, blah, and they have learned a lot and are going to redo it all from scratch, basically.

(27m 9s)

And that will happen before the Switch version.

(27m 13s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(27m 14s)

What are your thoughts on that?

(27m 15s) Al:

Which bit?

(27m 16s)

The rewriting it or…?

(27m 17s) Codey:

Yeah, like how do you feel like that is effective?

(27m 23s) Al:

Well, so I I can’t comment on the specifics, right?

(27m 27s)

Because I don’t know what the code looks like behind the scenes.

(27m 30s)

I think it is up to…

(27m 37s)

is too far gone, which does happen sometimes, right?

(27m 38s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(27m 40s) Al:

Like I have been on projects where you’re completely rewriting something from scratch because to get it to a decent standard would take far more work than just rewriting everything.

(27m 51s)

Um, and if that’s the case here, then that’s fine.

(27m 51s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(27m 55s) Al:

I mean, the thing is that we do, we do learn as we do things, right?

(27m 59s)

Like I’ve talked before about how there are things you can do as you’re going that makes life easier for you in the long run.

(28m 6s)

Like, for example, adding in controller support and rebinding or keys right from the very start, and that means every time you add a feature, you’re automatically adding that. And that is so much easier than coming to a game that doesn’t have controller support, doesn’t have key remapping, and you have to add it in everywhere, that if anything else, if not, if nothing else is just going to be weeks and weeks of the exact same thing, which is just demoralising, right?

(28m 14s) Codey:

Yeah.

(28m 34s)

Yeah.

(28m 34s) Al:

Um, whereas if you build it from the start, every feature you do a tiny little bit of that work and it means that the game always has that support.

(28m 43s)

And yeah, the start of it is difficult then because you’ve got a few, you’ve got a bunch of different things that you’re adding in that you’re not seeing anything from, but you know that as soon as you start implementing features you’re going to use those and it’s great.

(28m 51s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(28m 54s) Al:

And sometimes it’s hard to know what those things are as you go on, right?

(28m 59s)

Like when I started as a software developer, you go like, oh, yeah, yeah, well, you know, obviously we add tests, but like you think of it as like adding tests at the end rather than as you go.

(29m 10s)

And then as you become more experienced, you learn.

(29m 12s)

No, no, you got to add tests as you go because otherwise you’re trying to test things that you wrote 6 months ago.

(29m 17s)

You can’t remember it, right?

(29m 18s)

Like, that’s not how it works.

(29m 19s) Codey:

Yeah.

(29m 20s) Al:

So there’s lots of things like that.

(29m 22s)

And, you know, the one that, you know, the 2 the 2 big ones for software development in my view would be like accessibility, making sure that you put in things like screen reading technologies and stuff like that into it from the start, make sure that everything is, you know, fitting the standards that screen readers deal with and all that as you go rather than trying to go back and fix it all at the same time. And the other one that I forgot that was in my head, it’s gone.

(29m 44s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(29m 50s) Al:

Anyway, the point is, there’s things like that.

(29m 53s)

And if you get to the point where you have like a large number of them that you’ve not done and you have learnt about how to structure your code better, and all of these things together means that it’s too much to deal with and it’s overwhelming, actually scrapping everything and starting again, when you know what the functionality is to be, rewriting that functionality over again, can…

(30m 3s) Codey:

Yeah.

(30m 17s)

Mm.

(30m 18s)

I wonder, like, because there’s been times, you know, when I was 1st 1st doing specimens, for example, I look back at some of my 1st, the 1st things I pinned or, or mounted or whatever, and I cringe, like if there’s awful, but I can’t, you can’t go back and redo that.

(30m 35s) Al:

Hmm.

(30m 38s) Codey:

Or like some of them, I want to redo the labels because the labels I made were huge.

(30m 44s)

They were like a whole 8 point font.

(30m 46s)

Like you need like 4 point font for insect labels.

(30m 48s)

And so they were, they ended up being huge.

(30m 51s)

And I want to go back and remake all of those because I could, but it’s like, is it worth that or should you just move on with your life?

(30m 57s)

you know?

(30m 57s) Al:

Yeah.

(30m 57s) Codey:

And I’m, I guess like that, I’m wondering about that for this, because she’s the, I say she, I don’t know.

(31m 5s)

The developers, um, sounds like they’re holding off on… releasing it on Switch for now, and then they’re going in a completely new vision, so this is what they say.

(31m 17s)

completely new visual direction, rebuilt character art and animation pipelines, improved systems and gameplay foundations, and a much more polished and scalable structure overall.

(31m 28s)

Like, if it was just something like fixing some backend code, I would think that would be, I mean, I guess the quote unquote, is it worth it? is up to the person to decide.

(31m 41s)

And if the developer does feel like it’s worth it for them to do this entire overhaul, then more power to them.

(31m 49s)

But I’m just like, I’m wondering how much time that’s gonna take.

(31m 54s)

And if it’s, I guess this is a whole other philosophical question that could be had about like remaking or revamping games over and over and over again.

(31m 58s) Al:

Yeah.

(32m 3s) Codey:

And like, at what point do you need to not be a perfectionist and just like acknowledge that we grow and we learn and things get better and we move forward with our lives?

(32m 13s)

But I think, I think a part of that, that I’m not, that I might not be considering in this, in this, uh, rant here is that I think we’re, we’re the players really upset and disappointed in the game as well.

(32m 26s)

Like, Okay.

(32m 27s) Al:

It had mixed reviews.

(32m 29s) Codey:

Yeah, so maybe that’s something that they have to answer, the developer has to answer not only to themselves, but they want to make a better game for the people that supported them, which would make sense.

(32m 38s) Al:

Yeah.

(32m 38s) Codey:

Again, it’s completely up to them.

(32m 40s)

There’s just the part of me that when I see something like this, I’m like,

(32m 46s)

Um, but do you need to do that though?

(32m 49s)

Like,

(32m 50s) Al:

Yeah, that’s fair.

(32m 51s)

I guess it’s a difficult decision, right?

(32m 55s)

Do you, if a game has not been success.

(32m 57s)

Is that not success because the game has fundamental problems that you need to fix or is it because people just don’t want it?

(33m 5s)

And redoing it is not going to fix the 2nd problem, which I don’t know the answer to that.

(33m 10s) Codey:

Or like,

(33m 12s)

Yeah, or like another thing I’ve been thinking is lately is like, would people give it a 2nd chance?

(33m 19s)

Like if you were to play a game and be disappointed in how it was?

(33m 24s)

But then you heard that it had an overhaul, like how likely are you to go back and try it again?

(33m 29s) Al:

Yeah, yeah, especially as it’s been nearly 2 years since release.

(33m 33s)

We’ve talked about this before.

(33m 34s) Codey:

Yeah.

(33m 35s) Al:

Like, if you miss a game.

(33m 36s)

It’s really hard to go back and try it.

(33m 38s)

And if you try a game and it’s not what you hoped, are you going to go back?

(33m 39s) Codey:

Yeah.

(33m 43s) Al:

Realistically, what, 5 years later?

(33m 43s) Codey:

Yeah.

(33m 46s) Al:

Because, like, it’s obviously not going to be done this year. It is obviously not going to be done next year, right?

(33m 50s) Codey:

Um, my goal is to have the store back online around Memorial Day.

(33m 50s) Al:

If they’re just starting it.

(33m 55s) Codey:

Oh, that’s their merch store.

(33m 57s)

Sorry.

(33m 59s) Al:

That’s not.

(33m 59s)

If they’re if they’re just starting the rewrite now.

(34m) Codey:

Just kidding, just kidding.

(34m 1s)

Yeah.

(34m 2s) Al:

And they’re not just completely rewriting it, they’re changing things as well.

(34m 7s)

That’s going to be at least 2 years.

(34m 8s) Codey:

Yeah.

(34m 11s) Al:

Surely.

(34m 13s) Codey:

Yeah.

(34m 13s)

I’m not seeing a date or anything.

(34m 17s) Al:

No, because that would be silly too.

(34m 19s) Codey:

Yeah, you’re right.

(34m 19s) Al:

The only thing a date would tell us is that it’s not coming out on that date, right?

(34m 20s) Codey:

Um.

(34m 24s) Al:

Anyway, it’s a difficult one and I understand the want to do that and also it’s a big thing and who knows whether it’ll be…

(34m 31s) Codey:

Mhm.

(34m 36s) Al:

Because this is the thing.

(34m 36s)

I mean, is that the most painful thing if you redo everything and you make it better and it still isn’t successful?

(34m 42s) Codey:

Yeah, I guess that is dependent on the developer and how what their goal is from this, is it that they’re trying to recapture success that they had envisioned or is it that they want to be more proud of what was created.

(34m 56s)

Um, yeah.

(34m 57s) Al:

Or to have the money that you could do that.

(34m 59s)

Just be like, I just, I want to spend years redoing this, not for financial game, but because I,

(35m 6s) Codey:

Yeah.

(35m 8s) Al:

I don’t think most people…

(35m 11s) Codey:

Yeah, sorry, I’m very philosophical tonight, and I don’t or today, and I’m not entirely sure why, because I’m like, I’m on another, like, mental tangent now, but about something else, but it’s not related.

(35m 22s)

So we…

Haunted Chocolatier

(35m 24s) Al:

Haunted chocolatier.

(35m 26s)

Uh, concerned apes doing interviews again and saying things again.

(35m 31s)

It’s way bigger than Star G Valley, at least in terms of the amount of maps, the amount of monsters, the depth to the whole item system, and all the equipment slots, and all the stuff like this, he told game and farmer.

(35m 44s)

Everything is cranked up.

(35m 46s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(35m 46s) Al:

That’s a lot then, because like Stardew’s not a small game.

(35m 50s)

And then he says that he’s now trying to work on haunted chocolatier 5 days a week and spending the other 2 on Stardew Valley.

(36m)

And my question is, does he need an intervention?

(36m 4s) Codey:

When does he sleep?

(36m 6s)

Eric.

(36m 8s) Al:

You’ve had success.

(36m 10s)

This is where you get to rest.

(36m 12s)

What are you doing, man?

(36m 12s) Codey:

Yeah.

(36m 14s)

Though I am all for the 5 days of haunted chocolatier, uh, a week because that is close, get closer to getting my, uh, adding it to my successful score, Metacritic score for my, 5 days a week out.

(36m 30s) Al:

It’s not coming out this year.

(36m 33s)

Not coming out this year.

(36m 38s) Codey:

Um, yeah.

(36m 40s)

Uh, I mean, if he gets, if he genuinely, I mean, there are those humans that genuinely just like get, they don’t like downtime, and I can be that way, it’s really hard for me to flip between like rest and, because then when I’m quote unquote resting, I’m like thinking about all the things that I want to or should be doing.

(36m 59s)

So he might very well just be that kind of human.

(37m 2s)

Um,

(37m 4s) Al:

I also, yeah, I do wonder how much of it is to do with like, uh, other situational things, right?

(37m 11s)

Like, This is not meant to be like a, oh, parents work harder.

(37m 15s)

It’s not what I’m trying to say at all.

(37m 17s)

I just want to put that out there.

(37m 18s)

I do not believe that’s the case.

(37m 19s)

But like when you have kids, for example, like you, I… rest becomes a valuable commodity.

(37m 19s) Codey:

Okay.

(37m 29s) Al:

Like even if you previously wouldn’t have read, like I, before I had kids, I wouldn’t really spend days in bed.

(37m 29s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(37m 36s) Al:

I don’t do that now either, but I want to.

(37m 38s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(37m 39s) Al:

You know?

(37m 40s)

And there’s obviously other different situational things that people have.

(37m 42s) Codey:

Yeah.

(37m 47s) Al:

And yeah, I guess maybe some people just like that.

(37m 51s)

But I just, I worry like 7 days a week working every week.

(37m 55s)

That’s like, don’t don’t don’t kill yourself.

(37m 56s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(38m) Al:

Don’t, don’t, don’t die.

(38m 1s) Codey:

I mean, maybe it’s only, maybe it’s only a couple hours here, a couple hours there.

(38m 5s) Al:

That’s possible.

(38m 5s) Codey:

Maybe he has like smaller work hour work days, which is totally valid, but, um, yeah.

(38m 5s) Al:

Yeah.

(38m 9s)

Yeah.

(38m 12s)

That’s very true.

(38m 13s)

That’s very true.

(38m 14s)

If I were to work 4 hours a day.

(38m 16s) Codey:

Yeah.

(38m 16s) Al:

Would I be happy working 6 days a week?

(38m 19s)

Probably, yeah, not seven.

(38m 20s)

I still don’t want a decision.

(38m 21s)

I still want a day when I’m not thinking about it.

(38m 22s)

But then he also probably cares about his work.

(38m 23s) Codey:

Yeah.

(38m 24s)

Yeah.

(38m 25s) Al:

That’s the difference, right?

(38m 28s)

Between making something you want to make and doing something because someone else wants you to.

(38m 32s)

All right.

(38m 33s) Codey:

Yeah.

(38m 34s) Al:

That’s the news.

(38m 36s) Codey:

Oh, woo.

The Farmer Was Replaced

(38m 39s) Al:

We are going to talk about the farmer was replaced.

(38m 42s)

We’re going to start off with giving a quick overview of the game, and then I want to ask Cody something specific, which I think will be the most interesting thing about talking about this game.

(38m 48s) Codey:

Okay.

(38m 51s) Al:

So we’re going to start off by this is basically a farming game where you write code to harvest crops.

(38m 58s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(38m 58s) Al:

That is the simplest way of describing this and also probably the most full way of describing it, right?

(39m 6s)

Like there’s so many details and as you progress through, you get even more and more detailed on certain things.

(39m 12s)

But ultimately it is you write code for a drone to harvest crops, that’s fundamentally the game. I want to talk.

(39m 13s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(39m 21s)

Yep.

(39m 23s) Al:

Obviously, we can go into the details and I’ve got some stuff that I think it would be good to talk about, but like I 1st of all want to, Cody, we are obviously quite different in terms of our programming experience.

(39m 35s) Codey:

Yes.

(39m 35s) Al:

I am a software developer now of well, like 15 years, something like that, professionally.

(39m 42s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(39m 42s) Al:

I obviously coded when I was younger as well because nobody gets into coding having not done it in the spare time because we’re a weird type of person.

(39m 50s)

But you’re not completely new to programming.

(39m 55s)

So maybe it’s worth detailing your experience as well.

(39m 55s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(40m)

Yeah, so I, uh, have had some programming through like GIS, uh, we had to use SQL and uh, SQL and Python for some GIS stuff, uh, which is like a mapping thing that you can, yeah.

(40m 17s)

I had to do…

(40m 18s) Al:

Sorry, I said yes, like everybody would know.

(40m 20s)

I actually do know what GIS is, but maybe listeners don’t.

(40m 22s) Codey:

Yeah, I’m wondering, I’m just, it’s one of those things, GIS is so hard to explain.

(40m 26s)

It’s graphical or geographical information systems, and it’s basically like a map.

(40m 32s)

You make maps, but then you can also put data on those maps and analyse data spatially using those maps.

(40m 41s)

Um,

(40m 42s) Al:

I mean, what are maps if not, Dave?

(40m 43s) Codey:

Correct.

(40m 44s)

But different types of data. And and for some things with GIS, you can overlay, especially so say you have the, um, presence of certain, um, a certain insect.

(40m 46s) Al:

Yes.

(40m 57s) Codey:

So, or, or, like, presence absence.

(40m 59s)

So where you found it and where, I guess presence not presence is what, or sorry, presence and unknown, like where you did collect it and where you have not collected it, which doesn’t necessarily mean it’s not there, it just means you haven’t collected it.

(41m 12s)

You could then overlay that information with like temperature or, uh, trees that are there and that kind of thing.

(41m 21s)

And then, um, you can predict where the species may occur based on the knowledge that you have.

(41m 28s)

And it might predict rain, like other areas that you have not sampled and then you could go to those areas and see if you found the insect there and you can update your knowledge with based on that.

(41m 38s)

This is really useful for like hybridisation, whatever.

(41m 41s)

Uh, we use coding for that.

(41m 44s)

Um, in small amounts.

(41m 47s)

I think the biggest coding that I’ve done was just for statistics.

(41m 51s)

So I use R, um, and I use it to run statistics for my own data.

(41m 59s)

So I collect data.

(42m)

I put it into an Excel file that I turn into a CSV file and then I upload that into and I ask, uh, I run code for that.

(42m 8s)

And the code that I do in R is, I think, more friendly than Python and C++ and stuff like that to people that might not necessarily be coders on their own.

(42m 21s)

Um, it has.

(42m 22s) Al:

Yeah, I mean, it’s around a specific thing, right?

(42m 24s) Codey:

Yeah.

(42m 24s) Al:

Like whenever you have a programming language that is designed around something specific, it can be more user-friendly because there’s less it needs to do, right?

(42m 29s) Codey:

Yeah.

(42m 34s)

Yeah.

(42m 34s)

And like we can use, this is probably true for anything.

(42m 38s)

You can use packages that other people have created.

(42m 41s) Al:

Yeah.

(42m 41s) Codey:

Um, that include functions that other people have created that do something that is explainable so you can just say like, oh, I want to run this this function because I’m going to take this person’s package, which in R, it’s all open source, which is lovely.

(42m 56s)

Um, take this person’s package, run this function to run this model.

(43m 2s)

And there’s different parameters, you can change and everything.

(43m 5s)

So I do a lot of that and then I do a lot of visualisation as well.

(43m 7s)

So creating graphs from that.

(43m 9s)

So I have some experience with like going in and tweaking code and making code.

(43m 14s)

I think what I’ve always struggled with is generating code initially, like getting something on the page, which is what this game was.

(43m 23s) Al:

Yeah, do you know, the interesting thing about that, Cody, is I mean, I will never just sit in front of a blank screen and type code.

(43m 25s) Codey:

Yeah.

(43m 33s) Al:

Like, that’s not a thing that I do.

(43m 33s) Codey:

Yeah.

(43m 34s)

Yeah.

(43m 35s) Al:

I will, I will copy and paste something that I’ve previously done in Starfirm that because it’s so much easier.

(43m 40s) Codey:

Correct.

(43m 41s)

That’s what I do with my when I start a new project.

(43m 43s)

I will just take the code that I had previously and just basically, you can just change, here’s, uh, here’s your new input file, and then…

(43m 53s) Al:

Yeah, so I guess that’s my point is that that’s not unusual.

(43m 56s)

That’s standard for…

(43m 56s) Codey:

Yeah.

(43m 57s)

But I think that people who have coded for longer, at least, and this is, this could be completely wrong.

(44m 4s)

I think they have more experience and are more comfortable with starting from scratch. Or so I am always working with co- um, data that already exist.

(44m 16s)

These are data that I’ve collected, um, different categories or continuous variables, et cetera, et cetera.

(44m 22s)

They’ve already been named.

(44m 23s)

Whereas in some, uh, sometimes when people code, they make an entire new matrix.

(44m 31s)

Um, and I don’t under, like, again, this is also getting, I’ve, I was also been so curious about this because we both have Afantasia, and I struggle so much with matrices and that kind of thing because of my Afantasia.

(44m 39s) Al:

Yeah.

(44m 47s) Codey:

Um, like the 4 I and J and 4 blah, blah, for I and for I and range for J and range, like that kind of thing, I’m always like, I don’t understand what’s happening.

(44m 54s) Al:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(45m)

Do you know what, do you know what’s really interesting? Because, like, this is not the order I wanted to do these things, but apparently this is how it’s happening.

(45m 5s) Codey:

Okay.

(45m 6s) Al:

No, no, that’s fine.

(45m 7s)

There was actually a point where I had a programme running where I actually modelled out the farm in an array so I could physically see what I was doing. Because I was doing like, I have a few different things that I was doing and different strategies I was using. And I’ve probably gone way too far.

(45m 27s) Codey:

Uh-huh.

(45m 30s) Al:

And certainly we will approach, we will have approached this in very different ways, which is what I’m finding going to find interesting about this conversation.

(45m 36s)

But yeah, one of the strategies I was doing was I want a general kind of thing where it’s just like, I want to build up my stocks of hay and carrots and stuff like that. Because one of the things that we’ll be talking about is the fact that when you plant something, it costs a different thing, right?

(45m 37s) Codey:

Yeah.

(45m 46s)

Mm-hmm.

(45m 53s) Al:

So to plant carrots, it costs hay.

(45m 55s)

So you need to keep your stores of all of the things up.

(45m 56s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(45m 58s) Al:

And so sometimes you’ll want to do specifically like I’m focussing on pumpkins or I’m focussing on cacti and I will explain why you want to focus on them.

(46m 6s)

But to do that you have to have other things.

(46m 9s)

So I had like, here’s one, which is just like, I’m running low on some things.

(46m 12s)

Let me just run this and it’ll get me some hair.

(46m 15s)

get me some carrots.

(46m 16s)

It’ll get me some bumpings that will get me some wood, et cetera, et cetera.

(46m 20s)

And to do that, because I wanted a vague idea of how I wanted to lay this out, I literally just wrote out a 2D array of, I think it was 6 by 6 at that point, right?

(46m 20s) Codey:

Yeah.

(46m 31s) Al:

And just like, these are the things I want to put in.

(46m 32s) Codey:

Yeah.

(46m 34s) Al:

And then I just iterated over the array and put things in and that, I just love that because you were like talking about how it’s hard to visualise it. And so I literally just, I wrote it out.

(46m 37s) Codey:

Yeah.

(46m 44s)

You you drew.

(46m 44s) Al:

I wrote out the farm and what I wanted to go wear because trying to think of like the trees in particular are important about where you put them because the trees grow slower if they’re next to a tree.

(46m 45s) Codey:

Yeah, so.

(46m 54s)

Yeah.

(46m 56s) Al:

So you need to make sure the trees aren’t next to each other, but also sometimes you want to optimise for having as many trees as possible.

(47m 3s)

So I’m the same.

(47m 3s) Codey:

Yeah.

(47m 4s) Al:

I struggle to be like, okay, now what exactly is the modulo that I need to put here to make this comparison work to mean that I know that the trees are going to be in this lot, but not that one, and that one, but not that one.

(47m 16s) Codey:

Yeah.

(47m 17s) Al:

So I literally just wrote it.

(47m 19s)

I drew out the array.

(47m 21s) Codey:

Yeah.

(47m 21s) Al:

for the farm.

(47m 22s)

So yeah, that amused.

(47m 24s) Codey:

Yeah, that’s so that is like the, I was very curious like how we would do that because I also would probably just like grab a pen and paper and be like, okay, here’s what I want.

(47m 34s)

But another thing that’s beautiful about this game is that you can just do it.

(47m 40s)

And that’s what I love about coding in general is like if I’m, if I have a graph that I’ve made, but I’m like, mm, what would it look like if this was purple?

(47m 47s)

Literally just change it and then run it again, run that line of code again.

(47m 49s) Al:

Yeah, yeah.

(47m 52s) Codey:

And then it’s purple now.

(47m 53s)

And that was with this, it was like, mm, let me see, like, what if I change so that, uh, instead of this growing here, I grow something else here.

(48m 3s)

Um, you can just change that.

(48m 5s)

And then it’s very clear when it like breaks.

(48m 8s)

And then I always have 22 different, um, UIs up, not UAs, but like the code thing that you can, what, sorry, what is it?

(48m 18s) Al:

The editors.

(48m 21s)

Editor.

(48m 21s) Codey:

Editor, yeah.

(48m 21s) Al:

Just like the tech, the text screen where you’re taking.

(48m 23s) Codey:

Yes, so I always have 2 of those, that one that is running and actively getting me things while I then just copy paste whatever I’m, whatever the current like code I have is into the other one and then I’m like changing it there. So that if I try and like run the changes and it breaks, I’d be like, okay, just I’ll just run the other one again because it was working.

(48m 28s) Al:

Yeah.

(48m 28s)

Yeah.

(48m 42s)

Okay, let’s let’s pause here and get into some details about how the game works.

(48m 46s)

So obviously I talked about the fact that overall it’s like here is a square of X by X.

(48m 47s) Codey:

Yeah.

(48m 54s) Al:

It starts off.

(48m 55s)

I can’t remember what it was it 4 was it 9 by 3 by 3 or something?

(48m 59s) Codey:

I think it, I think it was 3 by 3, yeah.

(49m 2s) Al:

Yeah, 3 by 3 grid.

(49m 4s)

And your drone can do stuff on one of those items at a time.

(49m 11s)

And so your point is you have a whole bunch of different ways in the code to tell your drone what to do.

(49m 11s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(49m 16s) Al:

You can tell it to move, you can tell it to plant, you can tell it to harvest.

(49m 19s)

Um, and then over time, you gain more uh, functions in the code to do other things uh, in so many different ways.

(49m 29s)

So like, for example, this is probably going to get really detailed in in terms of like how code works.

(49m 35s)

So if you have never touched code, you might get a little bit confused about some of it, but hopefully there’ll be at least something interesting there.

(49m 36s) Codey:

Yeah.

(49m 41s) Al:

If you are a programmer, then I don’t know, we’ll see how that…

(49m 46s) Codey:

Could be like these, these children, they only just, Cody only just learned how to use 4 loops.

(49m 52s)

What?

(49m 52s) Al:

Yeah, thank you for not bundling me into that there, which you almost did.

(49m 56s) Codey:

No, it.

(49m 57s)

Yeah, no, no.

(49m 58s)

Like it, so this, that’s okay.

(50m) Al:

No, it’s fine.

(50m) Codey:

Yeah.

(50m 1s)

Because when I would run things before, and I will probably continue to do this.

(50m 2s) Al:

That fine.

(50m 5s) Codey:

I run individual, even if I have like 30 different models, I need to run with different, like, variables, I will just write out 30 models and run them all because then if something breaks, like, or if one of them is having an issue, I can I can figure out exactly which one it is without like a loop breaking.

(50m 21s) Al:

Mm-hmm.

(50m 21s)

Mm-hmm.

(50m 23s) Codey:

Um, but then people that code a lot or like, what are you doing?

(50m 26s) Al:

Mm-hmm.

(50m 26s) Codey:

Like, this is like a 1000 lines of code when it could just be like 50?

(50m 31s)

But anyway.

(50m 34s)

Um,

(50m 34s) Al:

I think that the import, I mean, if we’re talking about things in real life, right?

(50m 37s)

The important thing is that the code works for you and right?

(50m 39s) Codey:

Correct.

(50m 39s) Al:

Like you’re not, you’re not writing code that’s going to go run a banking system, so who cares what it looks like?

(50m 45s)

If it gets the job done for you, that’s the important thing.

(50m 45s) Codey:

Yeah.

(50m 46s)

Yeah.

(50m 47s) Al:

Um, so your, the, the, UI is obviously very different from normal farming games, um, but you have your farm, which is shown as this grid and you have uh, an editor, um, which is where you type code.

(51m 3s)

You can actually have multiple editors.

(51m 5s)

We’ll get into that, I’m sure.

(51m 6s)

And then you also have your help screen, which gives you details about how things work.

(51m 13s)

And then you have your drone and also a piggy bank drone as well.

(51m 18s)

It’s everything you harvest goes into the Big Bang Run.

(51m 19s) Codey:

That saves everything.

(51m 24s)

Mm-hmm.

(51m 24s) Al:

And the idea is, yeah, you write code in the editor, you click run, and your drone does stuff, assuming you’ve written code that actually compiles.

(51m 32s)

Um, and I, the, 1st up, what I think would be interesting to talk about is how did you find, because obviously this, some of the things in here will be things you’ve experienced before.

(51m 33s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(51m 45s) Al:

Some will be things you’ve heard of and some might be things that you’ve never dealt with.

(51m 45s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(51m 49s) Al:

I wonder, and I don’t know the question to this because the answer to this because obviously I am, you know, very experienced software developer.

(51m 50s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(51m 57s) Al:

Has this taught you anything?

(51m 58s) Codey:

Yeah.

(51m 59s)

Oh yes.

(51m 59s) Al:

And if so, and if so, how well did it do the teaching of that?

(52m 4s) Codey:

I learned a lot and I had actually had to stop because I was getting frustrated with how I was not learning.

(52m 11s)

And so I also contacts my husband is a coder as well.

(52m 14s)

So he, like, does a lot of software stuff as well.

(52m 17s)

So he was sitting next to me as I’m like sitting here struggling through 4 loops and he’s like, do you want help?

(52m 23s)

I’m like, after a while, I was like, yes, I actually do want help.

(52m 26s)

And then he’d be like, okay, so what if you do this at this?

(52m 29s)

Or like, what if what if you have a nested for loop?

(52m 33s)

And I’m like, oh, okay.

(52m 35s)

You can do that.

(52m 36s)

Because I think that was like the 1st issue that I was having.

(52m 38s)

Um, instead of just riding like move east, move east, move east or move south and like having to just like make that, um, creating a 4 loop so that it’s that it just like moves you around.

(52m 45s) Al:

Yeah.

(52m 54s)

Mm-hmm.

(52m 54s) Codey:

Um, I think was something that I, like, wouldn’t have realised on my own.

(53m)

I think another thing that really just continues to bug me is the wild true.

(53m 5s) Al:

Mm-hmm.

(53m 5s) Codey:

I’m not used to code that’s just constantly running.

(53m 10s) Al:

Mhm.

(53m 10s) Codey:

I’m used to code that is static that I I like change it a little bit and then I run one line and then it gives me an output.

(53m 19s)

And based on that output, I run something else.

(53m 21s)

So I’m not used to this like, because this is just constantly running.

(53m 25s)

Um, and I was just like, wow, true.

(53m 25s) Al:

Yeah.

(53m 27s) Codey:

Like, wow, what is true?

(53m 28s)

My husband was like, wild, true.

(53m 30s)

And I’m like, but what is…

(53m 31s) Al:

Well, while true, while true is true.

(53m 33s) Codey:

What about when wild falls?

(53m 37s)

And he’s like, it won’t be.

(53m 39s)

I don’t know.

(53m 39s)

I don’t remember exactly what he said, but I was just like, I don’t, I don’t get this.

(53m 45s) Al:

I mean, it’s yeah, it’s interesting because essentially, when you’re saying wild true,

(53m 48s)

You’re essentially saying, while yes.

(53m 51s)

While while you’re doing things, please.

(53m 52s) Codey:

Exactly.

(53m 55s) Al:

It’s like, but you’re doing things while existence.

(53m 56s) Codey:

Yeah.

(53m 59s) Al:

While we are alive, while this thing exists, while the computer runs, right?

(54m) Codey:

While.

(54m 4s) Al:

Like it’s just while yes.

(54m 5s) Codey:

Yeah.

(54m 6s)

It’s basically while while you have, while you have selected the run feature on this editor.

(54m 12s) Al:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly.

(54m 13s)

Whale code is running.

(54m 14s) Codey:

Yeah.

(54m 16s)

And I think I really struggled with that.

(54m 18s)

And then I really struggled with, um, for loops.

(54m 21s)

But everything else, like, I just had to stop myself from, like, changing code all the time, like, trying or, like, making things that could have been a 4 loop, basically.

(54m 32s) Al:

Yeah.

(54m 32s) Codey:

Um, And yeah, I’m not entirely sure.

(54m 37s)

I think so that was, that was weird, but other than that, like once it’s, once it gets into like the kind of puzzle element of, um, what you’re planting and everything, I think that made sense to me.

(54m 47s)

Um, so basically, uh, you can plant different things and each thing that you plant has different things that it does.

(54m 57s)

So the 1st thing you have is hay, and it just grows, it grows real fast.

(55m 1s)

Um, and so if you can, you can almost always harvest it because it’s like almost always available to be harvested because it grows so fast versus the bushes don’t grow as fast.

(55m 11s)

So can harvest might not always be true.

(55m 14s)

Um,

(55m 16s)

And so then you’d have to be like, okay, well, what do you plant here?

(55m 20s)

Are you just waiting for it to harvest?

(55m 22s)

Like, what do you do?

(55m 23s)

And so, And there were some really stupid things that I was like, why is this not like, like you break the code for stupid reasons?

(55m 33s)

And I think this is the classic, like, a software developer creates something and is like, it’s great.

(55m 37s)

And then the user, like, breaks it immediately because the user does something you were not expecting.

(55m 40s) Al:

Yeah.

(55m 43s) Codey:

Um, I have a lot of difficulty moving, like navigating the movement of my drone.

(55m 49s)

Um, but I basically have that figured out now and what I currently have.

(55m 55s)

I haven’t gotten to the cactuses yet.

(55m 56s)

What I currently have is, um, gosh, what is this, two, four, six, eight, 8 by 8.

(56m 4s)

And 2 roses, pumpkins, 2 roses, carrots, one row is hay, 2 rows is bushes, and then one row of sunflowers.

(56m 10s)

And I have not optimised… The sunflowers.

(56m 16s)

I mean, not optimise like anything because there’s different ways that you can optimise things and I just have not even attempted to do that.

(56m 23s)

Um, I also have not done trees, like you mentioned trees, like that was just starting to get really, like I, I, I, I’m not very good at like maximising the efficiency of these things.

(56m 36s)

Like I, I’m just like, one row is going to be trees.

(56m 39s)

One row is gonna be sunflowers.

(56m 40s) Al:

Yeah.

(56m 42s) Codey:

And if the sun, if, so I basically just have it constantly saying like, underneath you, if you can harvest it, harvest it.

(56m 48s)

And if, um, how have I said this?

(56m 50s) Al:

Yeah.

(56m 51s) Codey:

If get position y equals one or so if like basically you’re on y equals one or y equals two, then you’re a book, like what you’re going to plant as a bush versus like 3 is hay or whatever.

(57m 5s) Al:

Yep.

(57m 8s) Codey:

Um, and I have like a lot of if, if else’s, And if LFs, and yeah, I don’t know.

(57m 8s) Al:

Yeah.

(57m 15s) Codey:

I don’t know where my brain is at right now.

(57m 16s) Al:

No, that’s fine.

(57m 17s) Codey:

There’s a, like looking at it, I’m just like, there’s if, if, if else, if, if, else, if, else, if, like, it just keeps like going down and down and down and it depends on like how much wood I have, like I say, like, if you, if I have more than 300 wood, then harvest, otherwise, like, do, like, make plant bushes instead, basically.

(57m 37s)

Um, but if I don’t, instead of hay.

(57m 38s) Al:

Yeah.

(57m 40s) Codey:

But if I don’t have, if I have enough wood, which I currently have 17.2 k wood, so I’m fine.

(57m 45s)

Um, then it’ll just keep doing hay.

(57m 48s)

So, yeah.

(57m 50s)

I’m still in like the baby stages of it and I still definitely have things that I can do to iterate better.

(57m 56s) Al:

I, Yeah, no, I, I just, I think it’s interesting because I, I feel, and this is not, this is, this is meant to be a positive.

(58m 5s)

This is not meant to be a negative.

(58m 5s) Codey:

Yeah.

(58m 6s) Al:

I just want to make that clear.

(58m 7s)

The things that you are learning and that you’ve succeeded in getting to was probably about my 1st 10 minutes in the game, right?

(58m 13s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(58m 17s)

Yes.

(58m 18s) Al:

Because we have that different experience.

(58m 20s)

And I just think it’s really interesting because you’re like, oh, you know, you got, you had nested for a loops, explained to you and like, oh, I didn’t realise that was even a thing.

(58m 20s) Codey:

Yes.

(58m 29s) Al:

And what I did is, is I loaded up the game and I went, oh, right, okay, yeah, this wants me to do a nested for because I’ve got, is a 2D grid, right?

(58m 30s) Codey:

That was something that you yeah.

(58m 37s)

Yeah.

(58m 38s) Al:

Like that’s just like an automatic thing in my head at this point.

(58m 41s) Codey:

Yeah.

(58m 41s) Al:

Um, I want to post

(58m 41s) Codey:

Which I just.

(58m 43s) Al:

I want to post a picture, which is of my current setup of things.

(58m 44s) Codey:

Uh-huh.

(58m 49s) Al:

ignore the fact that everything is grass.

(58m 50s)

That’s just because I cleared it at one and didn’t actually run.

(58m 54s)

I just want to show you how many different editors and things that have running, not actually running, but like things that I can be running.

(59m 2s) Codey:

Okay.

(59m 2s) Al:

So I’ve posted it.

(59m 4s) Codey:

Okay, yeah.

(59m 6s)

Wait, can you have more than one running at the time at one time?

(59m 9s) Al:

Not, no.

(59m 10s)

So that’s what I’m saying.

(59m 11s) Codey:

Okay.

(59m 11s) Al:

So these are just like I have things set up.

(59m 13s)

So I have one which is, I want to, I want to get a bunch of carrots.

(59m 17s)

I have one, which is I want to focus on pumpkins.

(59m 19s)

I have one which is my cactus one.

(59m 21s)

I have one which is for the maze maze hunting.

(59m 27s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(59m 28s) Al:

I have one for just general.

(59m 30s)

I want to get a whole bunch.

(59m 31s)

like I want to re-get hay and wood and stuff like that.

(59m 34s)

Um, and yeah, these are of 2 very different scales, right?

(59m 36s) Codey:

There’s mine.

(59m 40s) Al:

Like my grid is 16 by 16 now.

(59m 42s) Codey:

Yes.

(59m 42s)

And so, but I think that’s the beautiful thing is that like I came up.

(59m 45s) Al:

Yeah.

(59m 46s) Codey:

I came into this, having some coding knowledge, but not, I, because I struggled so much with a raise and matrices and whatever, whenever I’ve tried to just do regular coding.

(59m 58s)

Um, if I can’t just say, uh, like, group, like, or like, um, filter.

(59m 59s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 6s) Codey:

So often I’ll like filter this column, if this column equals this value, then retain it.

(1h 12s)

Otherwise, like, like, so for me, that, in R, that is very, or like, I guess other Python, they have that as well.

(1h 12s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 19s) Codey:

But having it in this is so amorphous to me that it’s really hard for me to visualise, but this game really helps you visualise these things and it really like allowed me to actually like solidify a lot of these concepts.

(1h 33s)

Um, and so I’m, I’m really enjoying it.

(1h 34s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 40s) Codey:

and I want to keep playing it.

(1h 41s)

I think I was just getting frustrated with myself because it’s like I can tell that there’s there’s something or like some way to optimise things in a different way or whatever that I just haven’t like mentally unlocked yet.

(1h 52s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 55s) Codey:

Um,

(1h 57s) Al:

Yeah, it’s just looking at your code, it’s interesting.

(1h 59s)

There’s a lot of kind of more, I don’t know, when it necessarily want to say advanced, but like if you think about your coding experience before and how it is now, like there’s a lot of things there that are more like, would still take me a couple of minutes to be like, oh, yeah, of course I need to do this, right?

(1h 1m 6s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 1m 13s) Al:

Like there’s still not automatic things.

(1h 1m 15s)

It’s like, you’ve got your, you’re nested for a loop there, but your NSS4 loop is working automatically in the way that if you then upgrade the size, it’s still going to handle that and stuff like that.

(1h 1m 16s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 1m 26s)

Yep.

(1h 1m 26s)

Yep Yep.

(1h 1m 27s) Al:

Um,

(1h 1m 28s) Codey:

That’s, yeah, instead of having it be like, oh, for go, go 8 uh, across and then 8 down or whatever, like I’m just like, nope, just whatever the world size is.

(1h 1m 32s) Al:

Hard coded.

(1h 1m 34s)

Yeah, exactly.

(1h 1m 35s)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(1h 1m 39s) Codey:

I just, and then for some of them, like, like the wood one, like if you’re on the 3rd row, which is the hay row, if there is enough wood, then just do it or whatever.

(1h 1m 40s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 1m 51s) Codey:

But otherwise, like, we need more wood.

(1h 1m 51s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 1m 54s)

Yeah.

(1h 1m 54s) Codey:

So, so I, I definitely like have that forward thinking, like, I don’t want to have to go back and and fix this later type of thing.

(1h 2m 5s)

I will definitely have to, but, like, I’ve built that into that, like, 4 loops so that I won’t have to, like, mess with, ugh, I put 8 and now it’s 16.

(1h 2m 15s)

Um, But,

(1h 2m 16s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 2m 17s)

What I think would be very interesting for you is actually, and this is just me now telling you to code bear, um, one of the things that I’m seeing most in this code is there’s a lot of duplication that you could probably pull out into functions, right?

(1h 2m 23s) Codey:

Please.

(1h 2m 31s)

Yes.

(1h 2m 31s) Al:

For example, for every different type here, you’re doing, if it’s grass, harvest the grass, plant the thing I want to plant and then move.

(1h 2m 39s)

All of that can be pulled out into function, that you just pass through what the, what you want to plant, and then the function does all the things, and all you have to do each of these times is call that function once.

(1h 2m 43s) Codey:

Yep.

(1h 2m 47s)

Yep.

(1h 2m 52s) Al:

And that would like tidy things up a lot.

(1h 2m 54s)

It doesn’t change what’s happening.

(1h 2m 55s)

It just tidies the code up a lot.

(1h 2m 56s) Codey:

Right.

(1h 2m 57s) Al:

So if you change what you want to do on grass, right?

(1h 3m 1s)

You don’t have a problem where you’re missing it in one area, right?

(1h 3m 1s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 3m 7s) Al:

So say you decide you want to, instead of harvesting them planting, then moving east, you instead want to harvest them plant, then move west, you have to change that now in 5 different places.

(1h 3m 8s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 3m 17s) Al:

Whereas if you abstracted that into a function, you would only have to move, change it in one place.

(1h 3m 18s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 3m 22s) Al:

So it’s stuff like that, that this, as you go, if you continue playing, you will, I don’t presume you’ve not unlocked functions yet.

(1h 3m 22s) Codey:

Yes.

(1h 3m 27s)

Yeah.

(1h 3m 30s)

Um, I think I did right before I, like, stopped.

(1h 3m 34s) Al:

Okay, you gave up.

(1h 3m 35s)

Yeah.

(1h 3m 36s)

That’s that, yeah, so that for programmers listing, there’s a lot of fundamental programming things that you don’t have access to at the start, uh, because you have to unlock it through the skill tree, which we’ll get to in a minute.

(1h 3m 45s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 3m 49s) Al:

So as you keep, if you keep going, you’ll get to those points and you’ll eventually go and read the functions thing and learn about that and that will give you the ability to then tidy it up even more and get better code.

(1h 3m 53s) Codey:

Hmm.

(1h 4m 1s)

Yes.

(1h 4m 2s)

Yeah, I, right before I stopped playing, when I like did the big push of playing this, I had just unlocked variables and functions.

(1h 4m 11s)

So, which variables, I was like, this is great, because then I can just change it to Bush instead of entities.bush, or… Yes, yes.

(1h 4m 11s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 4m 16s)

Yeah.

(1h 4m 16s)

Yeah, that fundamentally changes how you’re doing things massively.

(1h 4m 21s)

That was the that was the point, I think, where I made my grid because I was like, yeah, finally, I can make my grid and I can refer to different variables and just be like pass them through rather than having to manually type everything.

(1h 4m 32s) Codey:

Yep.

(1h 4m 33s)

So that’s that’s when I stopped.

(1h 4m 35s)

But I really love the, um, the, like, the, the, help documents.

(1h 4m 44s) Al:

Yes, the documentation yeah.

(1h 4m 44s) Codey:

Um, I was the documentation.

(1h 4m 46s)

I, and I do this with code with my coding that I do in the real life as well, where the 1st time I run, and some people, not everyone does this.

(1h 4m 54s)

Like some people will just be like, oh, this is the thing that you run to run this statistical test, cool.

(1h 5m 1s)

And then they just move on with their life.

(1h 5m 3s)

But I try and like actually read a lot of the documentation to see exactly what’s happening because there are times when in the documentation, it says like, oh, and then this variable or this, um, parameter within the model means this.

(1h 5m 9s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 5m 17s) Codey:

And I’m like, ooh, I think people are using that wrong.

(1h 5m 19s)

Um, and so I really don’t, correct.

(1h 5m 20s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 5m 23s)

Wouldn’t be the 1st time.

(1h 5m 25s) Codey:

I really don’t like I like the documentation.

(1h 5m 27s)

The documentation also like hints at a lot of things sometimes.

(1h 5m 30s)

Like, I think in one of them, not the 4 loop.

(1h 5m 32s)

There’s there’s something in here where they’re like, see if you can figure out how to do this thing and then it has text that you could that’s currently like blocked that you could unhide or you could like hit show.

(1h 5m 43s) Al:

It’s got hints, yeah.

(1h 5m 43s) Codey:

Yeah, so it’s got those, so like, and I haven’t looked at those yet, but if I were truly stomped and felt like I had tried and exhausted every avenue, I could try that.

(1h 5m 53s)

But I think it really helps you to navigate that like learning process and it’s like telling you, oh, you could do this thing and you’re like, whoa, how would I do that?

(1h 6m) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 6m 5s) Codey:

And then you think about what you have access to right now.

(1h 6m 7s)

And how that, but I think it also unlocks a lot of things that it doesn’t necessarily tell you that it unlocks.

(1h 6m 14s)

So there’s some, so there’s the built-in functions that, uh, again, if you don’t look at the documentation, you might not know that some of those functions exist, like get world size, which is what I use instead of just doing a, uh, an amount for I and whatever.

(1h 6m 18s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 6m 30s)

Yeah.

(1h 6m 32s) Codey:

Um, and there’s some other things like I remember my husband being like, oh, have you unlocked like strings and I’m like, no.

(1h 6m 41s)

Um oh, my world is bigger.

(1h 6m 44s)

When did that happen?

(1h 6m 45s)

Oh no.

(1h 6m 48s)

Now I just have, I have a mega pumpkin currently that is, like, 4 by 4.

(1h 6m 55s) Al:

Okay, so let’s, yeah, okay, let’s, let’s talk about the unlocked tree then, because we’re kind of, we’re kind of there.

(1h 7m) Codey:

Yes.

(1h 7m 1s) Al:

So you start off with very few things you can do and you have to unlock them using different things.

(1h 7m 6s)

So, like, some things will cost hay, some things will cost wood.

(1h 7m 11s)

There is money in this game, but not till like late game, so we’ll probably not really talk about that.

(1h 7m 16s)

We might talk about it in a very passing way.

(1h 7m 20s)

But yeah, so for example, you start off just with the grass and the, do you have the bushes to start with or do you have to unlock the bushes?

(1h 7m 27s)

I can’t remember about it.

(1h 7m 28s) Codey:

I think you unlock them.

(1h 7m 31s)

Yeah, you unlock them.

(1h 7m 33s)

It’s plant, plant bushes.

(1h 7m 36s) Al:

Oh, yes, yes.

(1h 7m 37s) Codey:

So at 1st you’re just harvesting.

(1h 7m 37s) Al:

Okay, so yeah, so you just start, you’re just harvesting the grass because the grass grows automatically on grassland.

(1h 7m 42s)

Great.

(1h 7m 44s)

And then you unlock the ability to uh, to plant things which gives you the bushes and then you can also expand the farm, you then unlock different crops, which I want to go through all the crops.

(1h 8m)

And then you can also unlock other programming things.

(1h 8m 5s)

So for example, you can unlock some debug things like printing, which, uh, you know, programmers will know just shows something on the console. In this game, it doesn’t have a console that prints things on.

(1h 8m 14s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 8m 18s) Al:

Have you done the print?

(1h 8m 19s) Codey:

Yeah, so, well, but you can, you can print, so it basically print, it like comes up as like a little chemtrail above you, but you can print it.

(1h 8m 19s) Al:

Yeah, I love it.

(1h 8m 22s)

It’s fantastic.

(1h 8m 27s)

Yeah.

(1h 8m 29s) Codey:

You can like force print or something.

(1h 8m 30s)

I can’t remember exactly what it’s called, but, um, It basically pushes it to your command or to like a text editor in on your actual computer.

(1h 8m 40s) Al:

Yes.

(1h 8m 43s) Codey:

Um which was interesting.

(1h 8m 46s)

But I didn’t want that.

(1h 8m 47s)

Um

(1h 8m 48s) Al:

Quick print, that’s what they call it.

(1h 8m 50s) Codey:

Yes.

(1h 8m 50s) Al:

Um, and then so there’s other there’s other debugs things as well.

(1h 8m 54s)

you can get the ability to like change the world size to smaller if you want to test things and change the running speed and stuff like that.

(1h 9m 2s)

But there’s also another branch which is unlocking other like operators and stuff like that. So you can have like more comparisons.

(1h 9m 12s)

You can say if this is equal to this, if this is not this, et cetera.

(1h 9m 16s)

you can unlock sensors which allows the drone to see what’s underneath it.

(1h 9m 20s)

So that’s like, you know, if this is uh, if this is a pumpkin, then we do things differently with it.

(1h 9m 26s)

which you’ll understand why when we talk about pumpkins.

(1h 9m 27s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 9m 29s) Al:

And then there’s obviously variables you just talked about, there’s functions, there’s lists, there’s dictionaries, sets, you can import, um, a whole bunch of other things.

(1h 9m 42s)

Uh, there’s also you can, you can actually unlock things from eventually when you, but only if you still, you still have to have the requirements for it.

(1h 9m 51s)

So like I’m sitting here going, I don’t know why anybody would ever do this because you’re like, you’d have to write out a ridiculous amount of code to be able to like automate everything to the point where you then have enough that it makes sense to write the code to unlock something rather than just going into the tree and clicking on it.

(1h 9m 51s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 10m 11s)

Yeah.

(1h 10m 11s) Al:

But that’s a whole other conversation.

(1h 10m 14s)

And then there’s obviously there’s a different crops. You can unlock the ability to water, you can unlock the ability to fertilise.

(1h 10m 23s)

The interesting one is you can unlock the polyculture, which changes how much things yield based on what’s beside them, which can get quite complicated.

(1h 10m 32s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 10m 33s) Al:

You can unlock dinosaur bones.

(1h 10m 36s)

Um, you can also unlock mazes, which are the only way to get money.

(1h 10m 40s)

I presume you don’t have mazes.

(1h 10m 41s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 10m 42s)

Nope, I don’t have cactuses yet.

(1h 10m 45s)

so.

(1h 10m 45s) Al:

That’s fine.

(1h 10m 46s)

Um, and then there’s also Mega Farm, which allows you to have.

(1h 10m 55s)

Oh, apparently I can unlock now.

(1h 10m 57s)

Yay.

(1h 10m 57s)

I didn’t realise I had enough money for that.

(1h 10m 59s)

Nice.

(1h 11m)

Time to get distracted.

(1h 11m 1s)

So, they all do different things, but you know, it’s fundamentally about unlocking different ways to programme and also different crops to farm is basically what they unlock.

(1h 11m 13s) Codey:

Mm.

(1h 11m 15s) Al:

And what I like about the unlock tree is that it doesn’t, it means that, oh, not everything is thrown in your face all at once.

(1h 11m 22s)

So for someone like me, it was a bit frustrating not to be able to have variables, right?

(1h 11m 24s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 11m 25s) Al:

Right, the start.

(1h 11m 26s)

And it took ages to get variables.

(1h 11m 27s)

And that was a little bit frustrating.

(1h 11m 28s)

But for someone like you, having, you know, 10 different things that slowly unlock, so it’s like, okay, now you’ve gotten used to that, here’s another thing you can look at.

(1h 11m 34s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 11m 38s) Al:

I would imagine would be quite helpful.

(1h 11m 41s) Codey:

Yeah, I think I there were certain things like variables that I was like looking for.

(1h 11m 45s)

Um…

(1h 11m 46s) Al:

Yeah, okay, maybe variables was not the right example, but like, you know, you get my point.

(1h 11m 49s) Codey:

But like for me, but yeah, there, it’s, it makes it so that it’s not too much at once.

(1h 11m 54s)

Like, you control how fast things get unlocked so you can make sure, like, okay, I really understand the if, if else, uh, situ- if else situation.

(1h 11m 55s) Al:

Exactly.

(1h 12m 5s)

Yeah.

(1h 12m 7s) Codey:

So now I feel like I can move on to functions or whatever.

(1h 12m 11s)

Um, and I think that’s probably my next hurdle is functions.

(1h 12m 16s)

But like, I can see how someone who does this more frequently, um, you could get a little frustrated.

(1h 12m 23s)

It would probably feel like going back to elementary stuff because it’s like, I know I can, I know I can just do this, like.

(1h 12m 24s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 12m 28s)

Oh for sure.

(1h 12m 30s)

It just won’t let me.

(1h 12m 31s) Codey:

It just won’t let you because you haven’t unlocked.

(1h 12m 32s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 12m 35s)

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(1h 12m 36s)

I kind of, there was something quite early and I was like, because I’m not, I don’t write in Python.

(1h 12m 41s)

So like I, some of the things I had to relearn because I was just like, how do you do this in Bython?

(1h 12m 42s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 12m 47s) Al:

Because, you know, I know the concepts, but not the exact wording and syntax.

(1h 12m 47s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 12m 52s) Al:

And I was like, how do I do this?

(1h 12m 54s)

I can’t remember what it was, but how do I do this in Python?

(1h 12m 56s)

And it was like, oh, you do this?

(1h 12m 57s)

And I was like, oh, that doesn’t exist because I’ve not unlocked it yet.

(1h 13m 1s)

Great.

(1h 13m 2s)

You know, it’s just, that’s a whole new concept for a programmer is the idea of like, 0 no, you have to work to get your tools.

(1h 13m 9s)

You know?

(1h 13m 10s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 13m 10s) Al:

Um, So it was that was quite funny.

(1h 13m 14s)

Okay, let’s talk a different plants and things like that.

(1h 13m 19s)

So you start off with, as we mentioned, grass, grass just grows automatically on grasslands and you harvest it and then you get the bushes.

(1h 13m 28s)

Um, the bushes, um, can, I think they can be planted on grasslands as well as soil, don’t they?

(1h 13m 35s) Codey:

Yes, yes, they can be planted on both.

(1h 13m 36s) Al:

It’s carrots is the 1st thing you have to.

(1h 13m 37s)

Yeah.

(1h 13m 38s)

So you have to plant the bush and then it gives you wood.

(1h 13m 41s)

Great, fantastic.

(1h 13m 42s)

Simple.

(1h 13m 43s)

Then you get carrots.

(1h 13m 44s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 13m 45s) Al:

Now carrots obviously have to be in the soil, so you have to learn about tilling the ground.

(1h 13m 49s)

You tell the ground and you put the soil in it.

(1h 13m 51s)

And this is where the 1st kind of interesting thing comes in to me because if you till soil, you get back to grasslands.

(1h 13m 59s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 13m 59s) Al:

So you have to learn very quickly that you have to like be careful.

(1h 14m 3s)

You don’t just automatically till before you put a carrot in because it depends on what the ground was.

(1h 14m 6s) Codey:

Yep.

(1h 14m 7s)

Yep Yep.

(1h 14m 8s) Al:

So I like how they did that because it’s very quickly you have to learn about comparators, which is on the same layer of the tree, so you can unlock it pretty quick, pretty much at the same time as carrots.

(1h 14m 19s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 14m 21s)

Yeah.

(1h 14m 21s) Al:

And carrots is just you plant them and then eventually you can harvest them and you get carrots, carrots cost grass, I think.

(1h 14m 27s)

Or do they cost wood?

(1h 14m 29s) Codey:

Uh, they cost hay and wood.

(1h 14m 29s) Al:

Is it?

(1h 14m 30s)

The hay and wood.

(1h 14m 32s)

And then you can unlock trees which are like bushes, they give you wood, but they give you more wood, but as I mentioned before, you can, if you grow them next to each other, they take longer to grow.

(1h 14m 45s)

And I think if you have like a tree that’s surrounded by trees.

(1h 14m 48s)

I think it takes 64 times as long to grow.

(1h 14m 51s) Codey:

Gee.

(1h 14m 51s) Al:

So you really, really can’t just do a whole grid of trees because it will take forever to grow.

(1h 14m 57s)

So that’s where you then learn about only planting in specific places, right?

(1h 14m 57s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 15m 3s)

Yeah.

(1h 15m 3s) Al:

Because previously you could just go, oh, I’m just going to plant carrots now and just going to everything carrots, but you can’t do that for trees and so you have to think about where you’re placing them.

(1h 15m 8s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 15m 12s)

So how do you do that?

(1h 15m 15s) Al:

So you mean if you want like the most efficient thing?

(1h 15m 17s) Codey:

Do you do get get position X and get position Y?

(1h 15m 21s) Al:

Yeah, yeah.

(1h 15m 21s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 15m 21s) Al:

So what I would do is if I wanted to maximise the amount of wood that I’m getting in one set setting, I would use, do you know, you know about modulo, right?

(1h 15m 30s)

That’s a thing you would be aware of in maths.

(1h 15m 32s) Codey:

No.

(1h 15m 33s) Al:

No?

(1h 15m 33s)

So, uh, it’s about the remainder in a division.

(1h 15m 39s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 15m 39s) Al:

So if you do, uh, 10 mod, that’s probably too far.

(1h 15m 45s)

If we go 5 module two, 5 divided by 2 would be 2 remainder one, and the module gives you the remainder.

(1h 15m 52s) Codey:

Yes.

(1h 15m 55s) Al:

So 5 modulo 2 gives you one.

(1h 15m 55s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 15m 56s)

Okay.

(1h 15m 57s) Al:

4 modulo 2 gives you 0.

(1h 15m 58s) Codey:

Yeah, okay.

(1h 15m 59s) Al:

So that is a really important thing in figuring out trees because that allows you to figure out where you are relative to other trees in a way without having the like being able to check surrounding things, right?

(1h 16m 10s) Codey:

Mm.

(1h 16m 14s) Al:

So in a treat, if you’re wanting to plant trees in a checkerboard, right?

(1h 16m 20s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 16m 20s) Al:

You would do if X modulo 2 is equal to 0 and Y modulo 2 is equal to 0 or X modulo 2 equals one and Y modulo 2 equals one.

(1h 16m 36s)

And that gives you the, if you are on, if if they’re both 0, then you’re on an even square in both directions.

(1h 16m 44s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 16m 49s)

Yes.

(1h 16m 50s)

Yes.

(1h 16m 51s) Al:

So you’re either 0 or 2 or 4 or 6 or eight.

(1h 16m 55s)

So that means you’re not going to go 01.

(1h 16m 57s)

You’re going to go 00 or 02.

(1h 17m 1s)

You’re not going to go 01.

(1h 17m 1s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 17m 2s) Al:

I don’t know if I’m explaining this well or not.

(1h 17m 4s) Codey:

No, no, I get it.

(1h 17m 5s)

I was actually, I’ve been thinking like, how do I,

(1h 17m 8s)

How do I decide, how do I determine if something is even?

(1h 17m 11s)

versus odd.

(1h 17m 12s) Al:

That there you go.

(1h 17m 13s)

Modulo.

(1h 17m 13s) Codey:

Um, because that was something I’m like, you know, I would love to make it so that every other, uh,

(1h 17m 13s) Al:

Modulo too.

(1h 17m 15s)

Yeah.

(1h 17m 19s)

Yeah, because you could, because you could do it manually, right?

(1h 17m 21s)

You would go, if it’s, if, if it’s 0 and Z, if it X is 0 and Y is 0 or if X is 2 and Y is 2 or F X is 4 and Y is 4.

(1h 17m 30s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 17m 30s) Al:

But instead of just doing all those, yeah, you can just do if X modulo 2 is 0 and Y modulo 2 is 0.

(1h 17m 36s)

And that gives you all of the even squares.

(1h 17m 38s) Codey:

So I could do that for one row and then do odd for the other row.

(1h 17m 42s) Al:

Exactly.

(1h 17m 42s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 17m 42s) Al:

That’s exactly what you’re doing.

(1h 17m 44s)

Yeah.

(1h 17m 44s)

So then the odd ones would be X module or 2 is equal to one and Y module.

(1h 17m 49s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 17m 49s)

Okay.

(1h 17m 50s) Al:

Although if you’re only doing one, if you’re just focussing on one row, you obviously just need to do X.

(1h 17m 54s)

Whereas I’m thinking about an entire grid, right?

(1h 17m 57s)

If you’re looking at entire grid, you’re comparing X and Y.

(1h 17m 57s) Codey:

Yes.

(1h 18m) Al:

And so you want even in both directions or odd in both directions.

(1h 18m 5s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 18m 5s)

But that’s like part of that.

(1h 18m 6s) Al:

This is probably a terrible podcast.

(1h 18m 8s)

I’m so sorry.

(1h 18m 9s) Codey:

Well, so that’s part of that, like, optimisation thing that I just kind of didn’t.

(1h 18m 15s)

I have not tried trees because I was like, oh, that looks cool.

(1h 18m 17s) Al:

Yes.

(1h 18m 18s) Codey:

I’m not gonna do that, though.

(1h 18m 20s) Al:

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

(1h 18m 20s) Codey:

Um…

(1h 18m 20s) Al:

I think it gets worse from there.

(1h 18m 22s) Codey:

Yeah, so that was one of those things that I was just like, I’m just going to do bushes and it’s going to be fine.

(1h 18m 28s)

Um, but if you’re trying to make number go big.

(1h 18m 31s)

It’s not fine.

(1h 18m 33s) Al:

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

(1h 18m 34s)

So then you have sunflowers, which I haven’t actually done because I couldn’t be bothered learning how they work, but I think essentially if you harvest a sunflower, it speeds up your drone basically.

(1h 18m 39s) Codey:

Oh, okay.

(1h 18m 46s) Al:

Is that kind of how it works, temporarily speeds it up.

(1h 18m 47s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 18m 48s)

Yep, so you get power, so power, um, it automatically allows your power to move twice as, or sorry, you’re drawn to move twice as fast.

(1h 18m 57s)

Um, and it’s just kind of used on like an every 2nd basis or something like that.

(1h 19m 4s)

Um, the thing about sunflowers is if you harvest the sunflower that has the most pedals in the row 1st, you get more power.

(1h 19m 17s)

So it basically would require you to assess the number, like count the number of pedals or per row, and then like, so you’d have to do like a sweep where you like assess that on the row and then or wherever you have your sunflowers.

(1h 19m 18s) Al:

Ah, right.

(1h 19m 34s) Codey:

And then, uh, harvest them from top down from like most to lowest.

(1h 19m 36s) Al:

And then go back to it.

(1h 19m 38s)

Yeah.

(1h 19m 38s)

Yeah, yeah.

(1h 19m 40s) Codey:

And I have not done that.

(1h 19m 41s)

I don’t care about that

(1h 19m 42s)

So I just have a row of sunflowers.

(1h 19m 43s) Al:

Well, this is this is what I find interesting about this game is you can be like, oh, I want to be the most efficient, uh, which will come out, which is big in like pumpkins and cactuses, well, she’ll get into it in a minute.

(1h 19m 50s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 19m 54s)

Yes.

(1h 19m 55s) Al:

But you can also just brute force it and be like, I don’t care.

(1h 19m 57s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 19m 58s) Al:

Just give me stuff.

(1h 19m 59s)

And if you’re running it, you will get lots of stuff, right?

(1h 20m 3s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 20m 3s) Al:

It’s just that it will be slower than if you did it in the most efficient way possible.

(1h 20m 7s) Codey:

Yeah, like I’m, I might have to like let this run for 10 minutes while I go eat food, but I will still get all of the resources I need to unlock things in the unlock tray.

(1h 20m 19s)

So, um, though I guess that’s that wouldn’t work for everything, I think.

(1h 20m 19s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 20m 24s) Codey:

I don’t know if you can brute, because like, again, you can’t just convert everything to sunflowers.

(1h 20m 27s) Al:

Yeah, it might be hard.

(1h 20m 29s)

It might be hard to.

(1h 20m 30s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 20m 30s) Al:

Yeah, it might be hard to get the, you know, 1000000000 cactuses that you need without having some sort of optimise.

(1h 20m 38s) Codey:

Yes.

(1h 20m 39s)

Like, you can’t just be like, okay, well, I’m going to make everything a sunflower because sun, the cost of a sunflower is carrots.

(1h 20m 46s)

So you’re going to have to be growing carrots, which means that you have to be growing the hay and the grass and the wood, some wood bearing thing.

(1h 20m 54s)

Um, but I like it because it makes you, you kind of like have to be thinking about the entire array and like all of it, but you also kind of don’t because it’s just running on its own and then you can focus your attention on like the new thing.

(1h 21m 8s)

and just know that the code is going to run because it has it works.

(1h 21m 14s)

You built it the right way.

(1h 21m 15s)

Um, yeah.

(1h 21m 17s)

I like that.

(1h 21m 18s)

So Sunflowers is where I stopped.

(1h 21m 21s)

I guess I never tried trees, but sunflowers is where I was like, yeah, I’m not going to do that.

(1h 21m 24s)

Um,

(1h 21m 25s) Al:

So next we have pumpkins.

(1h 21m 27s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 21m 28s) Al:

The interesting thing about pumpkins is that you, they merge to create larger pumpkins as uh, Cody…

(1h 21m 36s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 21m 36s)

I currently have a 4 by 4.

(1h 21m 37s) Al:

And you get when you harvest a pumpkin, you get the cube number of the dimensions of that pumpkin.

(1h 21m 48s)

So if you have a pumpkin that is one, you get one, if you have a pumpkin that is 2 by 2, you get eight, if you have one that is 3 by 3, you get 27.

(1h 21m 56s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 22m) Al:

So you can see how that very quickly adds up.

(1h 22m 2s)

So you want to get, the idea with pumpkins is you want to get big pumpkins.

(1h 22m 3s) Codey:

Mhm, mm-hmm.

(1h 22m 8s) Al:

And but pumpkins when they when they mature have a 20% chance of dying.

(1h 22m 8s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 22m 15s) Al:

So you can’t just go, this entire grid is pumpkin now harvest because by the time you get to that point, you’re not going to have a mega pumpkin because 20% of them are going to be dead.

(1h 22m 15s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 22m 26s) Al:

So you then need to like go back and check if it’s dead and if so, replant it.

(1h 22m 26s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 22m 33s)

Also, I think if I don’t think you can, I think if you are above a dead pumpkin and you say can harvest, it’s like, I can’t, like, this is nothing.

(1h 22m 41s)

I don’t think that works.

(1h 22m 41s) Al:

Correct.

(1h 22m 43s) Codey:

So you have to it like forces you to do something different.

(1h 22m 48s) Al:

Yes, yeah, correct.

(1h 22m 49s)

But if you’re above a, like if you say, for example, have a 3 by 3 grid and you’re just going to make a big pumpkin, if you got to the top right after you’ve iterated over everything and it’s not a dead pumpkin, it will say you can harvest that as well.

(1h 23m 2s)

So you have to know whether or not there are.

(1h 23m 3s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 23m 7s)

I just brute force it.

(1h 23m 9s) Al:

Well, yeah, but it’s just going to be the least efficient, right?

(1h 23m 12s)

Whereas I currently have an algorithm going, which is going, it plants all the pumpkins and then it goes back and it replants all the dead ones and then it goes back and it basically when it gets to the end pumpkin, it will, well, I actually had 2 versions of it, one of which just always harvested the end pumpkin, and it meant that sometimes I would be harvesting small pumpkins and sometimes I would be harvesting slightly bigger ones, but eventually, eventually it would get to a mega pumpkin and it would harvest everything.

(1h 23m 12s) Codey:

Correct.

(1h 23m 20s)

Checks for dead pumpkins.

(1h 23m 21s)

Yep.

(1h 23m 26s)

Mm-hmm.

(1h 23m 31s)

Mm-hmm.

(1h 23m 37s)

Mm-hmm.

(1h 23m 41s) Al:

Which considering -6 and by 16 does take a while.

(1h 23m 42s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 23m 44s) Al:

But that was one another one you can do is like track, whether you’ve had dead pumpkins the last time or not.

(1h 23m 50s)

And if so, then you do another sweep, either of the entire thing if you want to be lazy or of the just the specific spots where you had dead pumpkins before.

(1h 23m 52s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 24m) Al:

So there’s different strategies of what, and in many different layers you can have different efficiencies of what you want to do, which is…

(1h 24m 1s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 24m 8s)

Mm-hmm.

(1h 24m 11s)

Yeah, and I think that that’s something that’s really interesting and like is indicative of coders in general, is you can have one person who does code one way and then you meet another person who does something like, and it’s different, but also possibly more efficient or less efficient, and you can be like, 0 my God, I’m going to do it for like that from now on.

(1h 24m 28s)

Um,

(1h 24m 30s) Al:

Yeah, I think the interesting thing about that is this comes to the one disadvantage that I think this game has, which is that there is our most efficient way to do everything because of how code complexity works.

(1h 24m 42s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 24m 45s) Al:

There is going to be a way because of how everything is structured.

(1h 24m 46s) Codey:

Hmm.

(1h 24m 49s) Al:

There is a most efficient way to do everything.

(1h 24m 51s)

And depending on what that is, those things can be more or less complicated, right?

(1h 24m 51s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 24m 55s) Al:

Like the most efficient way to get carrots is just you go iterate over every grid and make a carrot in each one and then harvest them all.

(1h 25m 2s)

Right.

(1h 25m 3s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 25m 3s) Al:

That’s the most, whereas the most efficient thing with a pumpkin is you iterate over and then you track, you go back over and you track where the dead ones were and you go back to only those spots until you’ve got to the and that’s the most efficient way to get pumpkins. And then the cacti, there’s a specific, most efficient way.

(1h 25m 13s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 25m 20s) Al:

But it’s like provable as well what the most efficient way is because of how maths works.

(1h 25m 22s) Codey:

Mhm, mhm, mhm.

(1h 25m 25s) Al:

I hate it.

(1h 25m 26s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 25m 26s) Al:

I’m never gonna do the work to figure out that.

(1h 25m 29s)

I’m just gonna, with, with programming, there are often uh, kind of standards that is this is the most efficient way to do something.

(1h 25m 39s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 25m 39s) Al:

We’ll get into that with the cactus because this is a perfect example in programming of the most efficient way to do things.

(1h 25m 43s) Codey:

Okay, I haven’t done the cactus yet, so tell me, tell me about the cat.

(1h 25m 44s) Al:

Okay, so the cactuses are interesting in that if you harvest them, if you if the cacti, so the cacti, let me start again.

(1h 25m 55s)

So the cacti can be different sizes, I think there’s 5 different sizes, one, to 3, or five.

(1h 25m 59s) Codey:

(1h 26m) Al:

Is it 10?

(1h 26m 1s) Codey:

Cacti come in 10 different sizes.

(1h 26m 4s) Al:

Goodness me.

(1h 26m 4s) Codey:

When harvested.

(1h 26m 4s) Al:

You can tell how long it is since I did the cacti algorithm.

(1h 26m 6s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 26m 8s) Al:

Um, if you, if they are ordered on the grid and you select, uh, the, you know, the one side of it, um, if they are properly ordered, they will all automatically harvest after you harvest the 1st one. And then, like the pumpkin, you get, I can’t remember if it’s exactly, if it’s a cube.

(1h 26m 28s)

I can’t remember the exact calculation for how much you get, but you get more if you harvest them in that way, right?

(1h 26m 35s)

So what you want to do is you want to sort the cacti.

(1h 26m 37s) Codey:

Mm.

(1h 26m 39s) Al:

Now, programmers will be suddenly thinking, oh, starting algorithms.

(1h 26m 43s)

I know sorting algorithms, but the problem with what you’re thinking programmer, O clever programmer, is the only way to sort the cacti is swap 2 cacti that are next to each other, which immediately takes out the most efficient sorting algorithms in programming, which I hate that they did this, but it’s so clever because it’s the complete opposite of what you would normally do with sorting things.

(1h 26m 45s) Codey:

Mhm.

(1h 27m 3s)

Mm-hmm.

(1h 27m 7s) Al:

So there’s a couple of different sorting algorithms that work that way and they are very simple to explain to things, right?

(1h 27m 14s)

to someone who’s new to starting algorithms.

(1h 27m 16s)

So basically what, the way that um, these algorithms works is you go from the bottom, you check the size of the current one and the size of the next one, if the, if the, if the, if the, if the, one you’re looking at is bigger than the one you’re, the next one, then you swap those two, right?

(1h 27m 25s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 27m 34s) Al:

That the kind of, and then you keep, you iterate over that and you keep going until there are no more that are bigger on the left than they are on the right and then you have it sorted.

(1h 27m 35s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 27m 44s) Al:

Now, that is a very simple sorting algorithm, but it’s a very inefficient sorting algorithm.

(1h 27m 48s)

Um, and so programmers will not want to do that by default, right?

(1h 27m 54s)

That’s what I think is very funny about this.

(1h 27m 56s)

is it’s making you do sorting algorithms that you don’t normally do because they’re bad.

(1h 27m 56s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 28m 2s)

Yeah.

(1h 28m 2s) Al:

But essentially, yeah, so you have your grid of cacti, you plant them all, and then you have to implement a sorting algorithm, which every programmer has done, mostly in interviews, because realistically in real life, you just use a library that is the most efficient way of, you don’t think about it.

(1h 28m 20s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 28m 21s) Al:

You just go, oh, well, that’s fine.

(1h 28m 23s)

But we’ve all, we’ve all been there and we’ve all done it.

(1h 28m 27s)

And so you, but then you have to think, oh, of course, I have to do a quick sort or a bubble sort or something like that.

(1h 28m 33s)

I have to do one of these annoying algorithms that are just a very bad algorithm, but they’re easy to explain, which I think is very funny.

(1h 28m 36s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 28m 40s) Al:

But it does mean that you’re actually your cacti are very, very slow.

(1h 28m 44s)

So I have a, as I said, I have a 16 by 16 grid and I have the a cacti cacti algorithm that will cover the entire 16 by 16 grid, but it takes like 10 minutes to sort it.

(1h 28m 52s) Codey:

Editor.

(1h 28m 53s)

Yeah.

(1h 28m 58s)

Mm-hmm.

(1h 28m 59s) Al:

That’s how slow it is.

(1h 29m)

But you get a lot of cacti in the end.

(1h 29m 3s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 29m 4s)

Well, so in the in the documentation, it just shows, um, like a 3 by 3.

(1h 29m 11s) Al:

Yes.

(1h 29m 11s) Codey:

Area.

(1h 29m 11s) Al:

Yep.

(1h 29m 12s) Codey:

Um.

(1h 29m 13s) Al:

It’s probably more sensible.

(1h 29m 16s)

To do a smaller one.

(1h 29m 16s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 29m 17s) Al:

I just, I just feel like if I’m going to leave my computer doing something anyway, then I may as well leave it doing the big grid.

(1h 29m 23s) Codey:

Because with the 16 by 16, how does that work then?

(1h 29m 26s)

Like, do all of the Western most ones have to be ones and then there’s 2s and then there’s 3s, like blah, blah, blah.

(1h 29m 34s) Al:

It depends on how many there are, but essentially, yeah.

(1h 29m 36s)

So it’s because obviously a one-dimensional sort is much easier than a two-dimensional sort.

(1h 29m 37s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 29m 42s)

Yeah.

(1h 29m 42s) Al:

one dimensional sort, it’s just smallest on left, biggest on the right, but with a two-dimensional sort.

(1h 29m 46s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 29m 48s) Al:

It’s like essentially smallest ones in the bottom left corner, biggest ones in the top right corner.

(1h 29m 52s) Codey:

Yes.

(1h 29m 53s) Al:

It doesn’t automatically mean that everything on the left-hand side is going to be size one.

(1h 29m 58s)

Um, but it means like the, the, they kind of go in a diagonal path.

(1h 29m 58s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 30m 5s)

Mm-hmm.

(1h 30m 6s) Al:

So if there was only one, it would be in the bottom left corner, if there are three, it would be in the bottom left corner, and then one up from that and one right from that.

(1h 30m 14s)

Does that make sense?

(1h 30m 15s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 30m 15s)

Yeah.

(1h 30m 16s) Al:

So diagonally sorted.

(1h 30m 19s)

Which does come, which does complicate the algorithm quite a bit, but it’s the same concept.

(1h 30m 19s) Codey:

I.

(1h 30m 23s)

Yeah, thinking about thinking about you creating one for a 16 by 16 is horrifying.

(1h 30m 28s) Al:

It’s the same logic.

(1h 30m 30s)

It works for any grid size.

(1h 30m 32s) Codey:

Yeah, but like that, just thinking about your your poor, poor drone.

(1h 30m 32s) Al:

But you can…

(1h 30m 38s) Codey:

Looking, and…

(1h 30m 39s) Al:

Let me write, shall I run it, shall I run one while we’re talking? Because I was just doing pumpkins, but let me do a cactus.

(1h 30m 45s)

It’s so painful to watch it, right?

(1h 30m 46s) Codey:

You’re poor, because your poor drone is like, is this one bigger than that one?

(1h 30m 51s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 30m 51s) Codey:

Okay, I’ll swap it.

(1h 30m 52s) Al:

I need to, it has to go over the grid like so many times, like what, 10, 20 times, something like that.

(1h 30m 52s) Codey:

Is this?

(1h 30m 53s)

Okay, this one’s fine.

(1h 30m 54s)

This one’s fine and it just has to like…

(1h 31m)

Can you not like tell it?

(1h 31m) Al:

And of course, it’s a 16 by 16 grid.

(1h 31m 3s)

So of course, it takes ages to go through one single pass. It’s so bad.

(1h 31m 6s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 31m 6s)

Can you tell it not to, like, worry about, like, can you can you make it so that the leftmost is finished and then you don’t have to go to the leftmost anymore?

(1h 31m 15s) Al:

Yes, that’s pretty much how the algorithm…

(1h 31m 18s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 31m 19s)

Like, okay, you don’t have to do this anymore.

(1h 31m 20s) Al:

It knows when it’s, it knows when it started a role.

(1h 31m 22s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 31m 22s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 31m 23s) Codey:

Oh, a row, not a column.

(1h 31m 23s) Al:

But like that takes a long time.

(1h 31m 25s)

Well, both.

(1h 31m 25s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 31m 26s) Al:

But that takes a long time.

(1h 31m 27s) Codey:

But they grow randomly.

(1h 31m 29s)

Like, you can’t, the one could be all the way on the right.

(1h 31m 34s) Al:

Correct.

(1h 31m 34s) Codey:

Woof.

(1h 31m 35s)

And then it says that they turn they’re brown if they’re not in the right order and they’re green when they are.

(1h 31m 40s)

Okay, so if you can figure.

(1h 31m 41s) Al:

Yes.

(1h 31m 43s)

Which is very visually pleasing to watch.

(1h 31m 45s) Codey:

Yes, I think like that would be something.

(1h 31m 45s) Al:

So it’s now finished, it’s now finished planting all the cacti, so now watching it, swapping them all.

(1h 31m 51s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 31m 52s)

Um, see, if you had sunflowers.

(1h 31m 57s)

That would go so fast.

(1h 31m 59s) Al:

Yeah, but then I wouldn’t get as many cacti in one goal.

(1h 32m 2s) Codey:

But if you if you had a stockpile of power, it would just double the amount of time that they.

(1h 32m 4s) Al:

Yeah, sure.

(1h 32m 5s)

I’ve just not done anything with sunflowers yet because I just I wasn’t in the right headspace to learn a new plant yet.

(1h 32m 12s) Codey:

Yeah, that’s that’s where I hit once I once I unlocked functions and variables and I saw that cactus was the next thing. I was like, I…

(1h 32m 22s)

And I think that’s that’s probably the downfall of this game is it is a game, but it is also not a game.

(1h 32m 27s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 32m 28s) Codey:

It is not, it is pleasing.

(1h 32m 31s)

It is not relaxing.

(1h 32m 33s)

I’m sure for some people it would be relaxing, but for me, it is very, like, I have to stay focussed and trying.

(1h 32m 33s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 32m 42s) Codey:

It’s like a puzzle to solve that is that I get frustrated with is do you have a road done?

(1h 32m 49s) Al:

Oh, no, no, no, yeah.

(1h 32m 50s) Codey:

That sweet baby angel, that poor drone.

(1h 32m 50s) Al:

No, yeah.

(1h 32m 53s) Codey:

Uh, while.

(1h 32m 54s) Al:

Oh, I think the bottom room?

(1h 32m 56s)

Oh, no, there’s still 2 out of order in the bottom room.

(1h 32m 58s)

But the problem is because it’s doing the entire grid every time, right?

(1h 33m 1s)

So it has to go all the way down to the bottom before it then sorts things once.

(1h 33m 5s) Codey:

So if you have 16, is it, do you have any that are 9?

(1h 33m 10s)

Uh, like 9 cactus, uh, size?

(1h 33m 11s) Al:

Name what?

(1h 33m 14s)

Size.

(1h 33m 15s)

Probably, yeah, but I’m not, let’s have a look, because you hover over.

(1h 33m 16s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 33m 17s)

You just have her over it, yeah.

(1h 33m 19s) Al:

Yeah, there’s that one’s nice.

(1h 33m 21s)

Yeah, there’s a few nines.

(1h 33m 23s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 33m 23s) Al:

So is it 0 to 9 then?

(1h 33m 25s)

Is that the sizing or is it one to?

(1h 33m 26s) Codey:

I think it’s one to, uh, let me.

(1h 33m 28s) Al:

No, it’s 0

(1h 33m 28s)

Yeah, 0 to nine.

(1h 33m 29s)

I don’t know what a cactus of size 0 would actually be in real life.

(1h 33m 33s)

That definitely doesn’t look size.

(1h 33m 34s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 33m 34s)

It is always one of these numbers, 0 through 9.

(1h 33m 38s)

And you can measure it.

(1h 33m 39s)

So yeah, I mean, measuring it is very similar to the, I think the sunflowers would be easier.

(1h 33m 45s) Al:

Yes.

(1h 33m 46s)

They’re the same sort of concept though, like you’re checking the size and then you’re sort.

(1h 33m 49s) Codey:

Where you measure it and then, but then you don’t, you don’t have to, you don’t have to.

(1h 33m 51s) Al:

yeah.

(1h 33m 51s)

You don’t sort them, but yeah, you have to, you have to go through and sort, uh, harvest the biggest one and then, so you’re tracking which one is biggest and then going back to that one and harvesting it and then doing the same thing again.

(1h 33m 53s) Codey:

No.

(1h 34m 1s)

Yeah.

(1h 34m 3s) Al:

So it’s a similar sort of concept, but obviously more, right?

(1h 34m 9s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 34m 9s) Al:

This is the thing about all of these is they’re getting more and more complex as you upgrade and unlock more things.

(1h 34m 15s)

Um

(1h 34m 16s) Codey:

I like the visual that it gives, though, that like, because it does make some pretty abstract concepts accessible because of the visual array.

(1h 34m 23s) Al:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 34m 25s)

Yeah, we have 5 sorted rows now.

(1h 34m 28s) Codey:

Oh, okay.

(1h 34m 29s)

Okay.

(1h 34m 30s) Al:

The next ones are going to take a long time, though.

(1h 34m 30s) Codey:

Wom, wom.

(1h 34m 33s)

Uh, we have neglected to talk about the coolest part, which is the hats.

(1h 34m 33s) Al:

Um…

(1h 34m 39s)

Oh yes, yes.

(1h 34m 39s)

Your drone wears a hat and you can get different hats.

(1h 34m 42s)

What hat are you wearing just now?

(1h 34m 44s) Codey:

The farmer hat.

(1h 34m 44s) Al:

Uh, what was that when you, is that brown hat?

(1h 34m 48s) Codey:

Uh.

(1h 34m 48s) Al:

Is that what that one’s called?

(1h 34m 49s)

Or is it called something?

(1h 34m 52s) Codey:

I don’t know if I can like look at

(1h 34m 53s) Al:

Do you not just did you not just say it in the code?

(1h 34m 55s) Codey:

Oh, it’s I mean, it’s gone.

(1h 34m 57s)

I did it forever ago.

(1h 34m 58s) Al:

I have I actually have it set every run because I am.

(1h 35m 5s)

At the beginning of all my code, I just have a wild loop that waits until the grass is able to harvest the 1st time. And because there is no no-op in the game, as far as I’m aware, I just have it setting the hat.

(1h 35m 18s)

So I just have that as my essent on the WAP, right?

(1h 35m 20s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 35m 20s) Al:

Because it’s just while this isn’t ready to harvest, put the hat that you currently have on on.

(1h 35m 26s)

This is essentially I know up, right?

(1h 35m 28s)

Uh, so that’s why I have I have the brown hat.

(1h 35m 28s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 35m 32s) Al:

But I have so many that I could use now because I’ve got cactus, carrot, dinosaur, gold, pumpkin, purple, traffic cone.

(1h 35m 33s) Codey:

I think.

(1h 35m 38s)

I’m wondering, how do you see which ones you have?

(1h 35m 41s) Al:

So see if you go, if you type in change hat, changer, just score hat, brackets, hats dot.

(1h 35m 46s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 35m 46s) Al:

It’ll come up with an auto-completion that lists all the ones you currently have access to.

(1h 35m 47s) Codey:

Oh.

(1h 35m 50s)

Okay, let me pull up my other editor.

(1h 35m 52s)

Change.

(1h 35m 54s)

I also like that it will like start automatically filling it in for you.

(1h 35m 59s)

Okay.

(1h 36m) Al:

Yes, the code completion is nice.

(1h 36m) Codey:

Brown carrot.

(1h 36m 2s) Al:

It’s a it’s a pretty nice IDE, but still quite simple in some ways.

(1h 36m 7s)

The other thing, I guess, to talk about is you can technically use any editor, you can integrate it into any editor.

(1h 36m 13s)

So if you’re a a person who likes to edit in a specific IDE, you can do that and then just import things in, which is fun.

(1h 36m 23s) Codey:

The purple hat is not very purple.

(1h 36m 23s) Al:

Oh, sad.

(1h 36m 26s)

But in this, I’m not, I’m not suggesting people do this, but what I was really interested in just as a theoretical thing is how well, uh, something like Claude or GitHub copilot would do it, doing something here, uh, I haven’t done anything with that because it feels completely unnecessary for what this is.

(1h 36m 47s)

I just think it’s a fun idea, like how well would an AI do at writing code for this?

(1h 36m 48s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 36m 55s)

Yeah, messing with my hats and another editor now.

(1h 36m 58s)

Um, I thought that I had changed my hat, but I guess I just had the basic hat because it was just the straw hat, which was the 1st hat you’re ever given, I think.

(1h 37m 5s) Al:

Mhm.

(1h 37m 8s)

Oh, straw hat then, right?

(1h 37m 9s)

okay

(1h 37m 10s)

I had brown hat, but that’s just because I haven’t upgraded it to one of the other ones.

(1h 37m 12s) Codey:

The brown hat looks like a cowboy hat.

(1h 37m 13s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 37m 15s)

Um, there’s a few other things that we could talk about.

(1h 37m 18s)

We could talk about watering, which is kind of like you get water as time goes on, and then you can use water and it speeds up the growing.

(1h 37m 26s)

There’s fertiliser, which is almost the same in that you get fertiliser over time and then you use it and it speeds up the growing, but this is where things get complicated.

(1h 37m 36s)

If you fertilise something, it becomes, oh, what was the word it used?

(1h 37m 44s)

fertiliser, you’re it becomes infected.

(1h 37m 49s)

If a plant is infected, half of its yield is turned into weird substance when it’s harvested.

(1h 37m 52s) Codey:

Mm, mm, mm.

(1h 37m 55s)

Yep.

(1h 37m 56s) Al:

Weird substance can also be used on plants which has the effect of toggling the infected status of the plant and all adjacent plants.

(1h 38m 4s)

So if you call use itemitems.weird substance on an infected plant, it will cure it, but if you use it on a healthy plant, it will infect it.

(1h 38m 12s)

If you use it on an infected plant that has healthy neighbours, it will cure the plant but infect the neighbours and vice versa.

(1h 38m 19s)

And I initially went, this is way too complicated.

(1h 38m 23s)

I don’t see any advantages.

(1h 38m 24s)

Oh, there we go.

(1h 38m 25s)

It just finished it finished the sorting and harvested.

(1h 38m 28s) Codey:

Yay.

(1h 38m 30s) Al:

Um, I don’t see any real upside to this.

(1h 38m 34s)

I’m just not going to not bother using fertiliser.

(1h 38m 36s)

And so I was like, I’m just not going to bother doing it until I realised that you need weird substance to unlock mazes.

(1h 38m 37s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 38m 42s) Al:

And so I then started using the fertiliser just to get the weird substance.

(1h 38m 48s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 38m 48s) Al:

Mazes are… If you use weird substance on a bush, it will create a maze and then you have pathfinding algorithm you have to implement to get treasure in the middle or somewhere in the maze.

(1h 39m 4s)

Again, there’s like a standard pathfinding algorithm you can use that is not the most efficient, but will get the job done all the time, which is just what I did in that situation because that’s fine.

(1h 39m 16s)

That’s the only way to get money is the mazes.

(1h 39m 18s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 39m 19s) Al:

You get money in the middle in somewhere in the maze.

(1h 39m 24s)

I don’t think we need to talk about any more of the details.

(1h 39m 26s)

I feel like we, you know, we’re getting into the depths of specifics unless there’s anything else you want to call out.

(1h 39m 32s) Codey:

Uh, no, I think that’s pretty much it.

(1h 39m 36s)

Um, yeah.

(1h 39m 36s) Al:

The other thing, the one other thing I want to talk about then is on the website for the farmers replace, they actually have a bunch of exact code examples, if you get really stuck with something, they have more than what’s in the hints.

(1h 39m 46s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 39m 48s) Al:

So they have like, here is a assorting algorithm for cacti, for example, they have that on there.

(1h 39m 54s) Codey:

Yeah.

(1h 39m 55s) Al:

Which I just think is fun because it’s like, obviously the point, this is clearly been written to try and get people into coding.

(1h 40m 2s)

And so they have they encourage you to do as much as you can, but then they also give you possible answers if you wanted to be able to do that, which I think is.

(1h 40m 14s) Codey:

Yeah, sorry, I’m trying to figure out how to make it.

(1h 40m 17s)

Trying to figure out how to like, because I just upgraded.

(1h 40m 20s)

I’m now this at the 16 by 16 and I’m trying to figure out like, because my, uh, if you’re in this why in this uh, row does not really work anymore for a lot of the stuff because it’s like, oh, if if you’re above row six, then you just uh, do all of it.

(1h 40m 22s) Al:

Oh, nice.

(1h 40m 41s) Codey:

And so then I have a lot of pumpkins on top and that’s not what I’m wanting. So I’m trying to say like if it’s between 4 through 12, do a carrot, but I can’t figure.

(1h 40m 44s) Al:

Ah.

(1h 40m 48s)

Mm-hmm.

(1h 40m 49s)

Yeah.

(1h 40m 50s) Codey:

I’m like trying to figure that out right now.

(1h 40m 52s) Al:

Uh, so you can do and in the F statement.

(1h 40m 55s)

So if greater than 3 and less than 8 or whatever, I can’t remember the exact numbers you used, but yeah, so the and keyword is your friend there.

(1h 40m 58s) Codey:

Less than?

(1h 41m)

Okay, cool.

(1h 41m 7s)

Okay, cool.

(1h 41m 8s)

Thank you.

(1h 41m 8s)

Uh.

(1h 41m 9s) Al:

Let me check if that, no, is it in the operators?

(1h 41m 13s) Codey:

That is not a valid expression.

(1h 41m 15s) Al:

It is in the operators.

(1h 41m 15s) Codey:

Oh, I probably have to say get pause.

(1h 41m 16s) Al:

You have to say, so like why, F, Y, greater than 3 and Y, less than 4 or whatever, rather than, I know, those are stupid, those contradict each other.

(1h 41m 21s) Codey:

Okay.

(1h 41m 26s) Al:

That’s not the point.

(1h 41m 27s)

So you can’t just put and less than you have to put and Y less than number as well.

(1h 41m 31s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 41m 32s) Al:

But yeah, if you want examples of it, you can look in the operator’s documentation.

(1h 41m 40s) Codey:

Yep, I was trying to figure that out because I do that in R when I’m filtering things.

(1h 41m 44s)

I’m like, you use the anyway.

(1h 41m 45s) Al:

Right.

(1h 41m 47s) Codey:

Figure that out though.

(1h 41m 48s)

No, uh, I am not sure how entertaining this is as a podcast for people, but, like, I think the takeaway is that you can definitely, even if you know how to use code because, like, I wasn’t a novice to coding, you do learn things.

(1h 41m 53s) Al:

Yeah.

(1h 42m 3s) Codey:

There is knowledge to be gained here, there, and like, I’m still aware of the fact that I could improve, um, the code that I have, um, and if that’s something, like, if I, you know, now that I have the 16 by 16, if I was like, man, I don’t really want to do cactuses yet, I’m going to improve my pumpkin thing.

(1h 42m 25s)

Then I can just like do that instead, which is really nice.

(1h 42m 28s) Al:

Yeah, I agree.

(1h 42m 29s)

I think if you have any interest in programming and or farming games, I think this is a fun game to play.

(1h 42m 36s)

I wouldn’t expect that anybody would spend like hours and hours and hours and hours in it unless you’re brand new and you really want to get really good at programming and this for some reason is the one thing that gets you into it.

(1h 42m 50s)

Um

(1h 42m 51s) Codey:

I definitely, I think that it could help.

(1h 42m 53s)

I, you know, in my jobless state, um, if you need your bugs identified, hire me.

(1h 43m)

Um, I was thinking about how I could, like, do data science, like biological data science or something, and that’s something that I could get that I could then move around.

(1h 43m 11s)

Um, and like do remotely.

(1h 43m 15s)

So if we do end up going somewhere else, or it’s something I could do like on the side, but then also do bugs.

(1h 43m 21s)

Like, I’m not going to get rid of bugs, but if bugs currently cannot pay me for a while.

(1h 43m 26s)

Um, it would be something, they don’t have money and the universe, well, the current leaders of the world do not value bugs.

(1h 43m 27s) Al:

Bugs don’t have money.

(1h 43m 35s) Codey:

So, um, like this is something that I could do, like the coding.

(1h 43m 40s)

So if that’s, if you’re, if it’s something that you’re interested in and you struggle with the visualisation, like I do, this will at least get you to understand the concepts in a way that might be more, um, approachable to you, because it definitely is for me.

(1h 43m 56s) Al:

Yeah, agreed.

Outro

(1h 43m 57s) Al:

All right.

(1h 43m 57s)

I think we’re done then.

(1h 43m 59s)

Thank you, Cody, for joining me for this fun programming podcast, apparently.

(1h 44m 4s) Codey:

Uh, I’m trying to think of pro, uh, pro cottage programme, cottage game.

(1h 44m 10s) Al:

Mm.

(1h 44m 13s) Codey:

I don’t know.

(1h 44m 15s) Al:

Is there anything you would like to tell the audience that isn’t a pun that accidentally turns into a word you don’t want to say?

(1h 44m 21s) Codey:

Oh.

(1h 44m 23s)

Um… Stay in school?

(1h 44m 27s)

I don’t know.

(1h 44m 28s)

Uh, no, just uh, if you are interested in learning about bugs or something, hit me up.

(1h 44m 33s)

If you are reading more books lately, hit me up.

(1h 44m 36s)

I currently reading yesteryear.

(1h 44m 38s)

which is about the TRAD wife that gets sent back to the 1850s.

(1h 44m 43s)

Um, very interesting, though there’s a twist, I guess, and I’m getting, I’m about to get to the twist.

(1h 44m 47s)

So excited about that.

(1h 44m 49s)

Um, yeah.

(1h 44m 51s)

I mean, I’m just kind of available at this point.

(1h 44m 53s)

I mean, I’m writing, but, oh, one thing I will tell the kids, the kids out there, if you’re, uh, ADHD stimulant is not working, get a different one because my goodness.

(1h 45m 5s)

I went from like, I would hyperfixate on a game.

(1h 45m 9s)

And it was more just out of boredom.

(1h 45m 11s)

Like I was bored and I didn’t want to work and I would just keep procrastinating, but I like, there’s that, like, I do want to work, but I have exec, like, executively, my brain is like, ah, and so I would just like get sucked into like a game or something else, and then suddenly it would be like the afternoon.

(1h 45m 28s)

Now I can only do something for like a half an hour before I’m like, hmm, I should probably get some work done.

(1h 45m 34s)

And it’s working with writing too, which is lovely because I hate writing.

(1h 45m 38s)

Um, so yeah.

(1h 45m 41s)

10 out of 10, right?

(1h 45m 44s) Al:

All right, you can find the podcast on Tumblr and on Twitter.

(1h 45m 48s)

Nope, on Tumblr and on Blue Sky at THS Pod.

(1h 45m 53s)

You can send us feedback from our website, Harveyseason.club.

(1h 45m 53s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 45m 57s) Al:

Tell us what is your favourite?

(1h 46m) Codey:

Programme.

(1h 46m) Al:

Wow, I was going to say programming operation.

(1h 46m 4s) Codey:

Oh.

(1h 46m 4s) Al:

Like make it weirder.

(1h 46m 5s)

No programming language.

(1h 46m 7s)

Nobody actually has a favourite programming language.

(1h 46m 9s)

They have a least unfavorite.

(1h 46m 11s) Codey:

I don’t know, Jeff, Jeff had some fun ones he was like.

(1h 46m 15s) Al:

Yeah, he’s just not used to them yet.

(1h 46m 17s)

He’ll hate them soon.

(1h 46m 18s) Codey:

Well, he was learning them for fun, like, on his own.

(1h 46m 20s) Al:

You’ll hate them soon enough.

(1h 46m 23s)

Every every programming language is terrible in its own special.

(1h 46m 27s) Codey:

Mm-hmm.

(1h 46m 29s) Al:

You can also find on our website how all our links to everything to do with the podcast, including our link to our page-rampage.com slash THS pod, where you can support the podcast, get access to our bonus episodes of the podcast, and get access to our Slack, where you can see some sneak peaks for things, and what have we been talking about?

(1h 46m 50s)

Oh, just people enjoying that I was happy about Lil Rocket Lab.

(1h 46m 55s)

That’s this week’s chat.

(1h 46m 57s)

Yep.

(1h 46m 57s) Codey:

Yep, sorry.

(1h 46m 58s) Al:

No, that’s fine.

(1h 46m 58s) Codey:

I am not sure.

(1h 47m) Al:

I think.

(1h 47m) Codey:

Not sure why this isn’t growing carrots.

(1h 47m 4s) Al:

Okay, that’s everything.

(1h 47m 5s)

Thank you, Cody, again for joining me.

(1h 47m 7s) Codey:

I figured it out.

(1h 47m 9s)

Thank you all for having me.

(1h 47m 10s) Al:

Thank you listeners for listening and until next time, have a good harvest.

(1h 47m 13s) Codey:

Good Harvard.

(1h 47m 15s) Al:

Woo.

(1h 47m 18s) Theme Tune:

The harvest season is created by Al McKinley, with support from our patrons, including our pro farmers, Kevin, Stewart, and Elisa.

(1h 47m 27s)

Our art is done by Mike the Brave, and our music is done by Nick Burgess.

(1h 47m 31s)

Feel free to visit our website, harvestseason.club for show notes and links to things we discussed in this episode.

(1h 47m 47s) Codey:

Wait, did did we do the introduction?

(1h 47m 51s) Al:

To what?

(1h 47m 51s) Codey:

Did I say my name is Cody?

(1h 47m 51s) Al:

The podcast.

(1h 47m 54s) Codey:

And we’re here today to talk about cottage core games.

(1h 47m 54s) Al:

Yes.

(1h 47m 58s)

Correct.

(1h 47m 58s) Codey:

And I said, oh, woo.

(1h 48m) Al:

Correct.

(1h 48m) Codey:

The farmer was replaced.

Made with Transcriptionist

The Harvest Season

The Cacti Are Sorted

Timings

Links

Contact

Transcript

Theme Tune

Intro

What Have We Been Up To

Game News

Bitter Harvest

OddFauna

Snacktorio

Harvest Moon: Echoes Of Teradea

Cosmic Coop

Hello Kitty Island Adventure

Critter Crops

Haunted Chocolatier

The Farmer Was Replaced

Outro